Life In 19x19

A pro recommended to a friend of mine that he should play on GoQuest a bunch of quick 9x9 games as a way to get better. They recently added 13x13 as well and seem to have a bunch of games going on. It doesn't compete with the big servers in number of games but might be a nice alternative for quick games on a tablet/phone.

http://wars.fm/go9

Seconded.
I think it is perfect for children too. My six-year old really likes the app - you can always get a game just about instantly (there are bots as a backup if no suitable human players are available). The interface couldn't get easier. The games are fast: 3 minutes with no byoyomi on the 9x9 board. There is an ELO-like rating to track your real progress, but there's also a "level completed" motivating mechanism where you never drop back once you have reached a certain level.

Antti told me he has been playing quite a bit of 9s on there, so I picked it up too. Ranks are wildly bogus, but for a few 9x9 quickies it's pretty good

Well, I discovered GoQuest a few days ago and I'm in love with it. Concerning the ranks, you gain a level at a time, starting from 30 kyu, but the server uses in fact the Elo system to pair you with an opponent and does so adequately pretty quickly, so it doesn't matter what rank you are except for motivation as gustav said before.
That being said, the ranks catch up with the Elo rating after many many games (a hundred?). Proof of that is the 'Position' list (let's take the 13x13 one I'm in): in there, with an Elo about 2500 you are 7dan (except for those who didn't play enough games). Around 2000 are the 3dan and around 1700 should be 1kyu.
As of today, I've played 31 games (20 wins and 11 defeats) have only a rank of 18kyu but my Elo rating is presently 1583. I checked on the Position list and we are 7 players to have an Elo rating of 1583: apart from me, three are 2kyu (one played 3850 games, another 1380 and the last 195), two 3kyu (333 and 375 games) and the last one is 13kyu (but played 'only' 66 games with 35 wins and 31 defeats).
Given the Elo rating of those I could defeat and could not, I'd say I could -maybe- reach an Elo rating of about 1700, but it'll need many many more games before my rank becomes 1 kyu.
Anyway, if and when this is the case, that would be just one rank difference with my 2kyu on KGS.
In conclusion, my belief is that even if the ranking system works as in a video game (one level at a time), it becomes reliable after a hundred games or so. That may seems a lot of games to adjust, but as stated above your rank is not what the server uses to pair the opponents: you play against people around your Elo who asked a game within 10 seconds. Sometimes you play relaxed games against someone a bit weaker than you (who might surprise you, be careful). Sometimes you play a tense game against someone supposed to be stronger and maybe learn a trick or two in the process. For my part, I'm having a lot a fun on 13x13 (5 minutes each) and found out that on this size I can review life and death patterns and some basic joseki, as well as train my reading and counting ability. Good exercise if you ask me.
And ah! I almost forgot! I talked about the Position list. Today, there are 6273 registered players on 13x13 (there were a bit less that 6000 a few days ago so it seems more and more people are coming quickly) so you can aim to reach the best possible position. With my Elo of 1583, I'm currently placed 1779.
In short, with Goquest you have many reasons to be motivated and willing to play.
So come at me!

Hi,
The only thing I miss in goquest is that we cannot put any text... that's weird to play a game with someone without saying at least 'hello' and 'thank you for the game'

oca wrote:Hi,
The only thing I miss in goquest is that we cannot put any text... that's weird to play a game with someone without saying at least 'hello' and 'thank you for the game'

for me, no chat is one of the things I like about this app.

Yes, it's really quite nice and also addictive. I'd certainly recommend it for a beginner, although the time limits might be too fast for them.

Guaranteed games within a few seconds is great and the interface couldn't be simpler.

A bit tacky for the other stuff around playing games, but you can't complain too much as it's free (apart from the adverts at the bottom).

I've got to 3 dan and a rating of about 2010 on 9x9 and probably settled at that level, perhaps I'll get a few more rating points sometime. So, I think it's reasonably accurate after you've played 100 games or so.

Jon

Their rank system is a bit interesting - should I be at 15 kyu at 1819 points?

illluck wrote:Their rank system is a bit interesting - should I be at 15 kyu at 1819 points?

If you still have 1819 points after 100 games or so, then you'll be 1dan according to the 'Position' lists (on both 9x9 and 13x13) which you can find through the crown icon on the welcome screen (Read my post above for more detailed explanations).

Yeah, it is pretty interesting. I probably have around 35 games or so in total at the moment. I'm now 13k at 1887, but only got 5.6 points from my last win against a 1d at 1862 who took black. Do you know if the points also depends on the ranks (would my point gains be throttled due to lower rank)?

Also, it's sad that I haven't yet noticed, but do you know if there is komi on the site? I know it has to be integer if there is one because I got a draw, but not sure if there is one.

illluck wrote:Yeah, it is pretty interesting. I probably have around 35 games or so in total at the moment. I'm now 13k at 1887, but only got 5.6 points from my last win against a 1d at 1862 who took black. Do you know if the points also depends on the ranks (would my point gains be throttled due to lower rank)?

Also, it's sad that I haven't yet noticed, but do you know if there is komi on the site? I know it has to be integer if there is one because I got a draw, but not sure if there is one.

Since the ranks are like levels on a video game, I believe it all depends exclusively on the difference between your Elo rating and your opponent's. So if your opponent was 1862 while you were 1887, you were a bit above him and won less points that if you beat someone with 1950 for example, but more than if you beat someone with 1650.
However 5.6 points seems a bit odd to me as it isn't a whole number. Check on 'My Page' and then touch the 'Win loss' line: you'll see the 30 last games you played with the Elo rating you had each time, so you'll see exactly how many Elo rating points you won/lost each time.
Concerning the komi, it is 7 points under Chinese rules, so don't forget to play the dame points, and capture with no worry the dead stones inside your territory if need be at the end in order to make sure that the server scores your points accurately.

I just found something interesting for those who want to know how to gain a rank in kyu/dan: in 'My Page', touch your rank and a 'Promotion Requirements' window will pop. Mine is saying '3 wins (Done 0 wins)'. Since I'm currently 15kyu that means I'll be 14kyu in 3 wins, plus the 'Done 0 wins' suggests that even if I lose the next game, I still will have to win only 3 times (?)
Well, I guess we'll see.

Woah, that app is really addictive :o

Dontbtme wrote:I just found something interesting for those who want to know how to gain a rank in kyu/dan: in 'My Page', touch your rank and a 'Promotion Requirements' window will pop. Mine is saying '3 wins (Done 0 wins)'. Since I'm currently 15kyu that means I'll be 14kyu in 3 wins, plus the 'Done 0 wins' suggests that even if I lose the next game, I still will have to win only 3 times (?)
Well, I guess we'll see.

You're correct; you only have to achieve a certain number of wins, not a certain number of consecutive wins. At higher levels, there may also be an ELO threshold for level up in addition to the wins requirement. However, once you've gone up a rank you never go backwards. I really like this system; the ELO keeps track of my current performance, while I also have an incentive to push past my peak performance.

When you first get started, your ELO is intentionally a bit suppressed. This goes away after a certain number of games (currently 40), and the system works surprisingly well for finding evenly matched opponents.

It's fun learning to play 9x9. When I first started playing on GoQuest, the (then) 7.5 komi seemed a tremendous advantage for white. I had to learn to be aggressive and willing to sacrifice stones, even on the smaller board. After a while, I actually began to prefer playing as black. My winning percentage is now about the same with either color, and is almost entirely determined by the level of my opponent. (As a KGS 7K on a 19x19 board, my rank stabilized between 1550 and 1600.)

At what I can see we can somehow invite friend (but I never tryied that feature)

Just in case my account is ... oca