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Help with 5-4
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 2:06 am
by Exologist
Needless to say, this is the first time I've really been unable to properly/consistently follow up on a particular move. The 5-4, I'm just terrible with it, especially when used like in the following game.
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50]TM[60]OT[25/540 Canadian]
PW[Exologist]PB[crazyhorse]WR[2k]BR[2k]DT[2010-07-21]PC[The KGS Go Server at
http://www.gokgs.com/]RE[B+Resign]
;B[pd]BL[58.091]
;W[cp]WL[51.692]C[crazyhorse [2k]: again, my best regards!
]
;B[op]BL[38.928]C[Exologist [2k]: hf
crazyhorse [2k]: lets play our best
Exologist [2k]: aw I hate that move
]
;W[dd]WL[38.413]C[crazyhorse [2k]: havent tried it in a bit =P
]
;B[iq]BL[27.934]
;W[nc]WL[25.955]
;B[pf]BL[20.981]
;W[pb]WL[15.997]
;B[lc]BL[14.004]
;W[ne]WL[11.275]
;B[ic]BL[531.973]OB[24]
;W[qc]WL[7.534]
;B[qj]BL[487.074]OB[23]
;W[qo]WL[538.159]OW[24]
;B[qm]BL[475.403]OB[22]
;W[pq]WL[532.157]OW[23]
;B[pp]BL[453.905]OB[21]
;W[qp]WL[528.862]OW[22]
;B[oq]BL[449.425]OB[20]
;W[pr]WL[522.475]OW[21]
;B[pn]BL[440.502]OB[19]
;W[nr]WL[512.587]OW[20]
;B[or]BL[433.046]OB[18]
;W[os]WL[510.929]OW[19]
;B[mq]BL[427.044]OB[17]
;W[fq]WL[496.952]OW[18]
;B[cj]BL[392.639]OB[16]
;W[kq]WL[493.467]OW[17]
;B[mr]BL[366.738]OB[15]
;W[ko]WL[483.633]OW[16]
;B[kr]BL[321.934]OB[14]
;W[ip]WL[468.55]OW[15]
;B[jq]BL[308.494]OB[13]
;W[jp]WL[463.653]OW[14]
;B[hq]BL[297.34]OB[12]
;W[hp]WL[449.941]OW[13]
;B[gq]BL[289.83]OB[11]
;W[gp]WL[446.576]OW[12]
;B[fr]BL[285.494]OB[10]
;W[eq]WL[433.993]OW[11]
;B[cm]BL[278.126]OB[9]
;W[cf]WL[403.718]OW[10]
;B[db]BL[237.838]OB[8]
;W[cc]WL[398.443]OW[9]
;B[cb]BL[227.693]OB[7]
;W[bb]WL[389.506]OW[8]
;B[fc]BL[194.487]OB[6]
;W[qe]WL[358.476]OW[7]
;B[od]BL[164.375]OB[5]
;W[nd]WL[348.681]OW[6]
;B[qf]BL[149.323]OB[4]
;W[rf]WL[293.932]OW[5]
;B[rg]BL[118.299]OB[3]
;W[re]WL[286.741]OW[4]
;B[of]BL[84.822]OB[2]
;W[dl]WL[241.181]OW[3]
;B[cl]BL[74.132]OB[1]
;W[dm]WL[238.782]OW[2]
;B[dk]BL[540]OB[25]
;W[cn]WL[227.152]OW[1]
;B[bn]BL[534.397]OB[24]
;W[bo]WL[540]OW[25]
;B[dn]BL[525.423]OB[23]
;W[en]WL[495.723]OW[24]
;B[co]BL[511.423]OB[22]
;W[do]WL[493.969]OW[23]
;B[cn]BL[497.677]OB[21]
;W[dp]WL[485.425]OW[22]
;B[em]BL[400.375]OB[20]
;W[el]WL[456.223]OW[21]
;B[fm]BL[393.208]OB[19]
;W[fl]WL[452.168]OW[20]
;B[fn]BL[386.92]OB[18]
;W[eo]WL[448.958]OW[19]
;B[gl]BL[381.177]OB[17]
;W[ej]WL[436.876]OW[18]
;B[hm]BL[371.275]OB[16]
;W[gj]WL[423.922]OW[17]
;B[hj]BL[339.844]OB[15]
;W[gk]WL[394.668]OW[16]
;B[hk]BL[334.242]OB[14]C[Exologist [2k]: dangit I lose
]
;W[qh]WL[316.48]OW[15]
;B[rh]BL[316.2]OB[13]
;W[pi]WL[273.319]OW[14]C[crazyhorse [2k]: who knows
]
;B[ni]BL[286.575]OB[12]
;W[oj]WL[263.103]OW[13]
;B[mk]BL[277.402]OB[11]
;W[nj]WL[248.32]OW[12]
;B[mj]BL[269.937]OB[10]
;W[mi]WL[235.21]OW[11]
;B[nh]BL[263.023]OB[9]C[Exologist [2k]: I know, that's who knows
crazyhorse [2k]: haha
Exologist [2k]: I didn't get to 3k for nothing, I know how to count xD
crazyhorse [2k]: im still learning that..
Exologist [2k]: thx
crazyhorse [2k]: hmm
crazyhorse [2k]: thanks for going easy on me
])
I might have resigned too early, but things looked pretty hopeless when I counted after I messed up even further with the silly invasion on the bottom (bad follow up on right-side invasion push me to resign). But really that 5-4 was distracting to the point of keeping me from my usual beneficial state of concentration. Perhaps I should've kept playing farther out along the bottom with m2 so as to not get closed in?
Note: This wasn't all that SERIOUS of a game. Trying new things with a friend from club. But I've been wondering about the 5-4 for a while now.
Re: Help with 5-4
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 3:01 am
by Harleqin
I do not see any big problem with that corner.
Later, I would play a tighter shimari in the lower left, and the invasion at L3 was surely premature. However, Black helped you a lot with L2.
Re: Help with 5-4
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 3:05 am
by daniel_the_smith
Agree. Black should be the one dissatisfied with that result if anyone should be.
Re: Help with 5-4
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:28 am
by Bill Spight
A couple of comments.
I see that I made them from Black's point of view.
Your approach at R-05 was good.
(;CA[UTF-8]ST[2]AP[GOWrite:2.2.21]FF[4]SZ[19]GM[1]OT[25/540 Canadian]RE[B+Resign]PW[Exologist]KM[6.5]GN[ ]WR[2k]PC[The KGS Go Server]DT[2010-07-21]RU[Japanese]FG[259:]TM[60.0]PM[0]BR[2k]PB[crazyhorse]
;BL[58.091]B[pd]
;W[cp]C[crazyhorse [2k]: again, my best regards!]WL[51.692]
;BL[38.928]B[op]C[Exologist [2k]: hfcrazyhorse [2k]: lets play our bestExologist [2k]: aw I hate that move]
;W[dd]C[crazyhorse [2k]: havent tried it in a bit =P]WL[38.413]
(
;BL[27.934]B[iq]C[*** Not so good. See variations.]
;W[nc]WL[25.955]
;BL[20.981]B[pf]
;W[pb]WL[15.997]
(
;BL[14.004]B[lc]
;W[ne]WL[11.275]
;BL[531.973]B[ic]OB[24]
;W[qc]WL[7.534]
;BL[487.074]B[qj]OB[23]
;OW[24]W[qo]WL[538.159]
(
;BL[475.403]B[qm]OB[22]C[*** Not so good. You are bolstering your strength. See variation.]
;OW[23]W[pq]WL[532.157]
(
;BL[453.905]B[pp]OB[21]C[*** Aji keshi. See variation.]
;OW[22]W[qp]WL[528.862]
;BL[449.425]B[oq]OB[20]
;OW[21]W[pr]WL[522.475]
(
;BL[440.502]B[pn]OB[19]C[*** Why so close? You are not threatening the corner. See variation.]
;OW[20]W[nr]WL[512.587]
(
;BL[433.046]B[or]OB[18]C[*** Aji keshi.]
;OW[19]W[os]WL[510.929]
;BL[427.044]B[mq]OB[17]
(
;OW[18]W[fq]C[*** See variation. End of comments.]WL[496.952]
;BL[392.639]B[cj]OB[16]
;OW[17]W[kq]WL[493.467]
;BL[366.738]B[mr]OB[15]
;OW[16]W[ko]WL[483.633]
;BL[321.934]B[kr]OB[14]
;OW[15]W[ip]WL[468.55]
;BL[308.494]B[jq]OB[13]
;OW[14]W[jp]WL[463.653]
;BL[297.34]B[hq]OB[12]
;OW[13]W[hp]WL[449.941]
;BL[289.83]B[gq]OB[11]
;OW[12]W[gp]WL[446.576]
;BL[285.494]B[fr]OB[10]
;OW[11]W[eq]WL[433.993]
;BL[278.126]B[cm]OB[9]
;OW[10]W[cf]WL[403.718]
;BL[237.838]B[db]OB[8]
;OW[9]W[cc]WL[398.443]
;BL[227.693]B[cb]OB[7]
;OW[8]W[bb]WL[389.506]
;BL[194.487]B[fc]OB[6]
;OW[7]W[qe]WL[358.476]
;BL[164.375]B[od]OB[5]
;OW[6]W[nd]WL[348.681]
;BL[149.323]B[qf]OB[4]
;OW[5]W[rf]WL[293.932]
;BL[118.299]B[rg]OB[3]
;OW[4]W[re]WL[286.741]
;BL[84.822]B[of]OB[2]
;OW[3]W[dl]WL[241.181]
;BL[74.132]B[cl]OB[1]
;OW[2]W[dm]WL[238.782]
;BL[540.0]B[dk]OB[25]
;OW[1]W[cn]WL[227.152]
;BL[534.397]B[bn]OB[24]
;OW[25]W[bo]WL[540.0]
;BL[525.423]B[dn]OB[23]
;OW[24]W[en]WL[495.723]
;BL[511.423]B[co]OB[22]
;OW[23]W[do]WL[493.969]
;BL[497.677]B[cn]OB[21]
;OW[22]W[dp]WL[485.425]
;BL[400.375]B[em]OB[20]
;OW[21]W[el]WL[456.223]
;BL[393.208]B[fm]OB[19]
;OW[20]W[fl]WL[452.168]
;BL[386.92]B[fn]OB[18]
;OW[19]W[eo]WL[448.958]
;BL[381.177]B[gl]OB[17]
;OW[18]W[ej]WL[436.876]
;BL[371.275]B[hm]OB[16]
;OW[17]W[gj]WL[423.922]
;BL[339.844]B[hj]OB[15]
;OW[16]W[gk]WL[394.668]
;BL[334.242]B[hk]OB[14]C[Exologist [2k]: dangit I lose]
;OW[15]W[qh]WL[316.48]
;BL[316.2]B[rh]OB[13]
;OW[14]W[pi]C[crazyhorse [2k]: who knows]WL[273.319]
;BL[286.575]B[ni]OB[12]
;OW[13]W[oj]WL[263.103]
;BL[277.402]B[mk]OB[11]
;OW[12]W[nj]WL[248.32]
;BL[269.937]B[mj]OB[10]
;OW[11]W[mi]WL[235.21]
;BL[263.023]B[nh]OB[9]C[Exologist [2k]: I know, that's who knowscrazyhorse [2k]: hahaExologist [2k]: I didn't get to 3k for nothing, I know how to count xDcrazyhorse [2k]: im still learning that..Exologist [2k]: thxcrazyhorse [2k]: hmmcrazyhorse [2k]: thanks for going easy on me]
)
(
;W[po]C[*** At some point, White may push and cut, thanks to the Black play at Q-06.]
;B[oo]
;W[on]
;B[om]C[*** Black might want to atari here.]
;W[nn]C[*** Now the aji keshi hurts.]
;W[nq]C[*** Ouch!]
)
)
(
;B[eq]
)
(
;B[mq]
)
)
(
;B[on]
)
)
(
;B[oq]
(
;W[pr]
;B[po]
;W[qp]
;B[pn]
)
(
;W[pp]
;B[oo]
)
)
)
(
;B[qq]
;W[ql]
;B[oj]
;W[ol]
)
)
(
;B[qp]
)
)
(
;B[eq]
)
(
;B[ep]
)
)