Life In 19x19

I occasionally see the term "power go" mentioned as a go style in articles, but I'm not sure what is meant by that. Is it a translation of some common term? Does it mean fighting or attacking or something else? Any examples?

Power go is often seen as a negative thing. It is basically someone who has great reading, and uses that reading to crawl around on the second line and take away opponent territory in exchange for influence. Then he will invade the influence and use his 'power' to compensate for his bad play. Basically 'power' go players usually will fight, play unreasonable moves and seek to make the game as complex as possible while annoying the opponent. If the opponent is not careful he will end up with no territory or get killed. Power go players rely on trying to confuse other players and then outread them when they play a hasty move out of annoyance. It's difficult to explain exactly, but it's a bit like bullying.

Though some high dan players sometimes have this kind of style, it's different from low level 'power' go but it is still reliant on outreading the opponent in complex situation.

I saw a player with this style in Beijing, he was nicknamed "The Butcher"

The way the owner of the club described the style was "primitive, but effective"

It is a very "Closed-fist" style

Power Go....

Now you're playing with POWER!!!

Sorry had to do it. I don't honestly know though.

nyuubi wrote:Power go is often seen as a negative thing. It is basically someone who has great reading, and uses that reading to crawl around on the second line and take away opponent territory in exchange for influence. Then he will invade the influence and use his 'power' to compensate for his bad play. Basically 'power' go players usually will fight, play unreasonable moves and seek to make the game as complex as possible while annoying the opponent. If the opponent is not careful he will end up with no territory or get killed. Power go players rely on trying to confuse other players and then outread them when they play a hasty move out of annoyance. It's difficult to explain exactly, but it's a bit like bullying.

Though some high dan players sometimes have this kind of style, it's different from low level 'power' go but it is still reliant on outreading the opponent in complex situation.

I gather these players rely on sophisticated tesuji as opposed to positional judgement.

I do not understand why power go would have a negative connotation.

Bill Spight wrote:I do not understand why power go would have a negative connotation.

Power Go players will take a long time to make a move especially when losing, since they have to read everything out.

Powwer go has no negative character as far as I can see. I think some of the posters above are judging from their own amateur perspective and basing their conclusions on how their (weak) amateur opponents play. For me power go implies severity and maximum pressure on the opponent but it does not imply unreasonableness. Among the great classical players Jowa played power go. Maybe Sakata, with his nickname of "razor-sharp" might also be said to have played power go.

To my understanding, the characterizing feature of power go is "ignore established fuseki and joseki theory, rely purely on reading and close combat". Would you agree with that?

Bill Spight wrote:I do not understand why power go would have a negative connotation.

Well, I think it depends on your perspective on what it is. If power go = "strongest at the middle game", then how could it have a negative connotation? But if power go = "intentionally creates confusing situations in the hopes of eliciting a dumb mistake," then who would want to play against such a style?

entropi wrote:To my understanding, the characterizing feature of power go is "ignore established fuseki and joseki theory, rely purely on reading and close combat". Would you agree with that?

I don't think the above quite does it. Besides what I wrote earlier, a power go player shows true strength when confused fighting breaks out.

jts wrote:

Bill Spight wrote:I do not understand why power go would have a negative connotation.

Well, I think it depends on your perspective on what it is. If power go = "strongest at the middle game", then how could it have a negative connotation? But if power go = "intentionally creates confusing situations in the hopes of eliciting a dumb mistake," then who would want to play against such a style?

If people don't want to play against it, that sounds like a good style.

It seems from some descriptions that the power go player might have more trouble than usual against an opponent with equal reading ability. (Your Jedi mind tricks don't work on me. ) If that is the case, I can see why it could be looked down upon a bit. Such a player might not be held up as a model for weaker players to emulate.

Playing for complications is a valid approach, though. I don't think a definition of "power go" that encompasses, say, most Korean professionals and almost every amateur on Tygem would be a useful term.

jts wrote:

Bill Spight wrote:I do not understand why power go would have a negative connotation.

Well, I think it depends on your perspective on what it is. If power go = "strongest at the middle game", then how could it have a negative connotation? But if power go = "intentionally creates confusing situations in the hopes of eliciting a dumb mistake," then who would want to play against such a style?

If we're dueling and I have very good balance, Forcing you onto a narrow raised platform is just controlling the ground. Controlling the ground and proper balance and footwork is part of the fight.

And confusing situations are fun! I don't think it's about "hoping my opponent makes a mistake" (Though if we are at all honest with ourselves, we are all hoping the sum total of our mistakes was less than the sum total of our opponents mistakes),

it's about seeing something in the board that's beautiful and complex, and wanting to follow your intuition to the end.

I think "power go" players would look at non-"power go" players and ask "Why are you too scared to follow the white rabbit?"

The player that I was referring to before, "The Butcher", his moves never let up, there wasn't even the slightest moment where I or his other opponents weren't under constant pressure. He sees the weakness in your position so clearly, and then pushes the knife directly to it.

I think it's that directness that bothers players. Players are used to the size of the 19x19 board giving them room to breathe, to build their castles before the war starts.

gowan wrote:Powwer go has no negative character as far as I can see. I think some of the posters above are judging from their own amateur perspective and basing their conclusions on how their (weak) amateur opponents play. For me power go implies severity and maximum pressure on the opponent but it does not imply unreasonableness. Among the great classical players Jowa played power go. Maybe Sakata, with his nickname of "razor-sharp" might also be said to have played power go.

Or Seo Pong-su or Cho Chikun. Even Go Seigen maybe. Just really thrive on the game always being on the edge of catastrophe.

I remember Mingjiu showing a game of Lee Sedol and laughing at a certain move. He said, "this move. It's not the move to play because you just want to win the game. It's a move you play to [some Chinese term gets translated]." "Yes, to break your opponent's spirit!"

I hadn't heard of "power go" before this thread and have no idea what context it's normally used in.