Life In 19x19

So after looking around, I can see KGS admins have reputation of being unjust and rash. I got approached by seventeen (maybe 17 years old?) and he was acting all serious (which was funny to me) about other possible accounts I might have. I told him the straight truth (that I don't), yet I got blocked (for how long?)

After he finally started spilling some of the beans, I got an idea of what he was talking about. Since when is it wrong to let your friends log in to kgs through your computer? HOW does that make their accounts 'mine'? Better yet, how can you ban someone for that and not get demoted from admin position?????

KGS You guys have no idea what you're doing. This is the most RANDOM thing ever. It's actually pretty funny.

/rant

That's because when a banning occurs, the IP address is blocked to avoid that you just log on with another nick.
The only time I was ever banned was, when my children played there and one of them got banned because of "flooding". Usually the ban does not take long.

So I'm getting some responses from KGS admins..


I don't know.. we just play xbox, play go, play chess, play basketball. Then out of nowhere I start getting questioned like I'm involved in some crime, the hacking of all KGS accounts or something. So I lol a little..

Admin: Why are you laughing? I'm serious.
Sorry but, it's spontaneously hilarious. I was just waiting for someone to go "April Fools! Aaahhh you fell for it!"

Sorry for taking up your time in reading this funny experience

karaklis wrote:That's because when a banning occurs, the IP address is blocked to avoid that you just log on with another nick.
The only time I was ever banned was, when my children played there and one of them got banned because of "flooding". Usually the ban does not take long.

Yes, but when a ban sticks because you (or someone else using the same IP) are already banned and log in with another account (but the same IP) likely no admin contacts and quiz you about your accounts. The OP says he got banned for the multiple accounts - but as there are plenty of people incl. admins with multiple accounts I wonder whether it is the whole story.

What on Earth are you even talking about?

Ok.. Now I'm getting pissed off

Really, really pissed off This is the darkside to KGS Go? No wonder I hear bad rep about kgs. They get you excited about Go, and when you are addicted, they strip it all away!

I am totally hopeless here... what can I do? Play at a different server where no one speaks English? I can't believe this nonsense!!! I'm really trying not to swear.. even Zen gods would frown upon this display!

An admin named Doug messages me, I thought things were progressing, now I see he has a loose screw. The things he tells me.. WHAT IS WRONG WITH HIM?? It's like I'm talking to an 8year old, 20kyu player! Shall I post the logs?

Yes, after going back and forwards with emails and nonsense, I think I'm losing it!!!
______________________________________________________________________________________________

Translation:
If you are just a plain addicted GO player, just started working hard, you did nothing wrong. But then you get banned and DERANKED?? What would you do? I need advice because KGS is like the only place people speak English and can get reviews

I feel like someone kicked me in the groin.. Is this a sick joke by kgs admins??

This would go better if you could provide a coherent explanation of what happened. Your posts barely make any sense.

Crazy4Go wrote:So after looking around, I can see KGS admins have reputation of being unjust and rash. I got approached by seventeen (maybe 17 years old?) and he was acting all serious (which was funny to me)

I don't know the details of your situation so I can't really comment, but one thing that may help explain seventeen's conversational style is that he (like most KGS admins) is not a native English speaker. Just something to keep in mind.

If your responses to KGS admins were as incoherent and rude as your posts here, I'm not surprised you managed to get banned.

Having multiple accounts if fine on KGS. Most players I know have several. But there are a few things you should not do with multiple accounts. In particular you should not use them to dodge bans, or to abuse the ranking system.

You getting deranked probably means that admins thought you were abusing the rank system somehow. Perhaps you played ranked games against your friend, who was using the same IP. That's certainly suspicious behavior, and warrants you getting contacted by an admin. If you respond to that by making fun of the admin, you getting banned and deranked wouldn't be unexpected.

My first post says exactly/everything that happened?

1.) I just finished an ASR League game, then a friendly 3d was giving me a game review, we were checking a corner situation.
2.) The 3d tells me that seventeen (admin) wants to talk with me, then I realize he had PM'd me. So we wrap up the review and I go see what he wants.
3.) seventeen (admin) asks if I have any other accounts. I tell him no and he begins accusing me of multiple accounts and sandbagging.
4.) After requesting what he's talking about, he says I have logged in to other accounts, so I explain to him more than 2-3 people have signed in to KGS from my internet.

5.) I am banned, no goodbye, just the connection suddenly is blocked.

6.) I email admins with complaint, asking to be unbanned (why was I banned in first place???? I didn't even know that could happen)
7.) Doug replies, asks me for nicks of other accounts that have logged in. I answer truthly: I am not sure. I say the names that I can remember they use (but I mean, I don't bug them to tell me every account they have?), but not sure what else.
8.) Doug keeps me banned, AND deranks me (whatever derank is?)

Saying things like:

I am also troubled that you beat a ranked robot with the correct
handicap so easily. This indicates to me that your skill level exceeds
your current rank on this account.

I note that you play GnuGo (11k) quite a bit giving a handicap of six stones. Theoretically, this handicap means that the games should be equal. However, when I look at the results, you win each game, often by significant amounts (e.g., 134.5 points). This doesn't make sense to me.

- Has this guy actually ever played Go? Is he serious? My KGS nick is Calsetin, look it up. Look at my games with GnuGo 11k. It's not my fault the bot is just really dumb/weak. If you look at my games with him, every time I play him I play the same way and always kill the same big group. Why? I don't know, the bot just lets me, it doesn't know how to play differently?


9.) So what was the point of contacting Doug/KGS Support? All he did was ask me simple questions, which I gave the simple answer to, and he says I don't "convince" him? It's the truth! There is nothing to convince??

Is this what KGS admins are? Aren't they supposed to set an example or something? Disgusting.

Li Kao wrote:If your responses to KGS admins were as incoherent and rude as your posts here, I'm not surprised you managed to get banned.

Having multiple accounts if fine on KGS. Most players I know have several. But there are a few things you should not do with multiple accounts. In particular you should not use them to dodge bans, or to abuse the ranking system.

You getting deranked probably means that admins thought you were abusing the rank system somehow. Perhaps you played ranked games against your friend, who was using the same IP. That's certainly suspicious behavior, and warrants you getting contacted by an admin. If you respond to that by making fun of the admin, you getting banned and deranked wouldn't be unexpected.

I wish I had conversation log with seventeen. I was completely calm the whole time, just trying to figure out the situation. But he banned me before he even explained everything!

When I sent email to admin@gokgs.com, I also approach in a decent way, such as:

I just got very UNRIGHTFULLY banned by
> an admin called seventeen. Firstly, I'd like to say this is total abuse, I
> did nothing wrong, I don't know what's going on, I asked him to explain but
> he ignored and told me to read terms of service. I don't even know where to
> find that! I asked for link, and no answer.

I Hope that's not rude?

Funny thing is.. me rude? They are being super rude with me! They got me smacking my head against the wall. How about you don't automatically defend the admin, without understanding that I did nothing wrong first. I'm the victim here, I have every right to be frustrated! I'm sorry, but put yourself in my addicted shoes

KGS Terms of Service
http://www.gokgs.com/tos.jsp

I just read through that, and the only thing that I am guilty for is this:

Doug (from email):
>> I also note in your games that you use the acronym "wtf". Please do
>> not use this acronym on KGS, as KGS is a family-friendly site and any
>> use or implied use of the f-word is inappropriate.

Then I read this..
"Usually a warning will be given before any action is taken" (source: KGS Terms of Service)

Where is my warning for using the 3 letter acronym? Why was I banned on the spot by seventeen!??? What? Why? How? Who? Why??

Nowhere in the terms of service does it say that more than 1 person can't log in to KGS in same household. Look at my games! (nick: calsetin) How can you call me a sandbagger?? The 2 things I'm being accused with, where is the prooof???? What are they basing this BLIND accusation on?? Better question, Why won't admins tell me?

(parody) Admin: "well, we noticed you have logged in to more than 1 account in your household"
Yea? AND??????? WTF?

Honestly, do admins actually play Go or have any actual knowledge at all?
KGS is operated by volunteers (source: KGS Terms of Service)

- Maybe that explains a few things.. Volunteers eh. How do I volunteer to be admin? I would sure love to ban people for no reason.

I wasn't being rude at first, but now I deserve every right to be as rude as I want. If Go is supposed to be a beautiful game, how can we say that when we have "administrators" doing things LIKE THIS!??

Having looked at some of your games, I don't think you should have been deranked.

However, sandbaggers do exist, and if you have some friends with a BIG strength gap playing from your machine, it's a good idea to outline the situation at once.

Crazy4Go wrote:I wasn't being rude at first, but now I deserve every right to be as rude as I want. If Go is supposed to be a beautiful game, how can we say that when we have "administrators" doing things LIKE THIS!??

Please note that if you intend to be rude on L19, be aware that debates should be kept civil as per L19 rules and guidelines.

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