It is currently Wed Apr 30, 2025 7:19 am

View unanswered posts | View active topics View unread posts | View new posts | View your posts


Board index » L19²GO (Malkovich) » 1-on-1 Malkovich games

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]



Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 1 of 3
  [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Author Message
Offline Perception
 Post subject: 20. Perception (8k) vs. xDragon (9k)
Post #1 Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:03 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Continuing from where we left off.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . W . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X 1 X 3 . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . 7 . O O X O 2 X 5 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X a 6 8 . . W . . 4 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Have to block here first. I can live easily though it will probably be in gote. This way leaves the threat of a still.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X 1 X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X a 3 4 O O X O . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X 0 2 8 7 d W 9 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . b . 6 5 . c . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If I play 6 in the previous diagram at 2 here I live in a smaller area, still in gote. The diagram continues with a-d.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X 1 X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . 3 . O O X O a X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 2 4 . . W 5 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Another possibility.

If he keeps sente I expect him to play somewhere on the right side. If 5 at 6 I can play 5 at a.


Attachments:
File comment: .sgf of the game so far
Perception.v.xDragon.sgf [401 Bytes]
Downloaded 723 times
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline xDragon
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #2 Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:31 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 153
Location: around
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 47
Rank: 5k
KGS: xDragon
tried to make this move on godiscussions but it never went thru.

also if anyone can move the comments to here thatd be appreciated

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X B X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


this was the plan when i made the tiger mouth. wait and see what he does next
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #3 Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:35 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1378
Location: wHam!lton, Aotearoa
Liked others: 253
Was liked: 105
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . a . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . b . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . W . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Assuming White lives in Gote as he plans; these moves occur to me. I'd probably be inclined towards B, myself. Develop some of that intense influence. Also stop W making a base easily on the right.

_________________
Revisiting Go - Study Journal
My Programming Blog - About the evolution of my go bot.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Perception
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #4 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:39 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O W X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I don't know, this feels wrong but just skipping it and playing at 'a' seems like it gives a similar result but I'm confined in a smaller area (as I showed in my last post.)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O W X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . a . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline xDragon
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #5 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:44 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 153
Location: around
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 47
Rank: 5k
KGS: xDragon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cb:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X B . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


pretty sure this is forced.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #6 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:49 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1435
Location: California
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 171
Rank: Out of practice
GD Posts: 1104
KGS: fwiffo
Have the players considered the double hane?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Double-hane when you can!
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X 1 . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . 2 3 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X 1 5 . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X 4 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . 7 2 3 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X 1 5 . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X 4 7 . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . 6 2 3 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This seems great for black any way you slice it.

_________________
KGS 4 kyu - Game Archive - Keyboard Otaku
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Perception
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #7 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:55 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 48 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I don't really like this move either but because I played L3 I feel like I need to play this.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline xDragon
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #8 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:00 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 153
Location: around
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 47
Rank: 5k
KGS: xDragon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 49 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


this seems very good for me. still have g4 to fix my wall in sente too. though i may need to play q10 soon
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #9 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:05 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1435
Location: California
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 171
Rank: Out of practice
GD Posts: 1104
KGS: fwiffo
BUMMER! It seems neither player even considered it.

_________________
KGS 4 kyu - Game Archive - Keyboard Otaku
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Dusk Eagle
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #10 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:19 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1758
Liked others: 378
Was liked: 375
Rank: 4d
Here's the posts from GD, in case something happens to that site.


Attachments:
File comment: Perception vs xDragon
perception_vs_xDragon.zip [135.42 KiB]
Downloaded 733 times

_________________
We don't know who we are; we don't know where we are.
Each of us woke up one moment and here we were in the darkness.
We're nameless things with no memory; no knowledge of what went before,
No understanding of what is now, no knowledge of what will be.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline unkx80
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #11 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:24 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 257
Location: Singapore
Liked others: 13
Was liked: 30
Rank: Dan player
For Fwiffo:

Double hane is possible but not mandatory, especially with the cutting points at a and b.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 49 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . a O b . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

_________________
My homepages: http://senseis.xmp.net/?Unkx80 and http://yeefan.sg/.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Perception
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #12 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:03 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . W . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I need to do some reading before making a move here. If I'm already alive I can take sente and go play somewhere else. If not I need to play something like e3.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 5 a . . O . 3 O 2 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm alive here. if he plays 4 at 'a' I play at 4 and I'm alive.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . 2 3 . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


After 3 here I don't see a way for my group to be killed.

Anyways I think I'm alive in sente now. So I'd like to pincer his stone in the top right and/or reduce the influence of that big wall that I gave him.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . a b . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . c . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


a and b are the two pincers I'm thinking about. I don't have any idea how to continue from other pincers such as c here. Ideally I want to find a continuation that allows me to play some stones in the center to reduce the effect of his wall. I haven't really studied any of these pincers though so I'll just have to try to come up with something.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O 5 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . 7 3 2 9 X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . 6 4 0 a . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Continuing with the cut at a I can probably take the corner. That gives me a lot of solid profit so I think it's bad for him even though he gets more influence working with his wall.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . 7 O 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . 3 2 6 X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . 9 8 5 . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . 0 . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

the above diagram...
continues in...
the diagram below...
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . O X X X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X 1 . O . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . 4 2 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . 3 2 . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . 4 . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I really don't know how to continue after either pincer. I think the high pincer gives me a better chance of reducing the influence of his wall though. If I play a low pincer he can try to keep me low.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline explo
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #13 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:25 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 108
Location: France
Liked others: 14
Was liked: 18
Rank: FFG 1d
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . W . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . 3 1 O 2 . O 5 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 6 . 4 . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Maybe white is already alive but this is very painful. White can also capture 1 instead, but again he'll get a very small life in gote.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Dusk Eagle
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #14 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:00 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1758
Liked others: 378
Was liked: 375
Rank: 4d
To add to what explo said, this is very bad for white to tenuki. It does not threaten to kill the top-left corner (no move does) and black gets so much in sente...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X y y . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X y y X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X y y y W W X O O X X y y y y y y |
$$ | . . X y y y 3 1 O 2 . O 5 y y y y y y |
$$ | . . . y y y . . 6 . 4 . . . . y y y y |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The one thing I think these two players need to learn the most is to keep your groups healthy. Healthy does not equal alive. Healthy means your group cannot get pushed all over to the benefit of your opponent. But both players are currently taking big plays before urgent plays. If they were to stop doing this and focus on the weak groups they might improve by two stones.

_________________
We don't know who we are; we don't know where we are.
Each of us woke up one moment and here we were in the darkness.
We're nameless things with no memory; no knowledge of what went before,
No understanding of what is now, no knowledge of what will be.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline xDragon
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #15 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:52 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 153
Location: around
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 47
Rank: 5k
KGS: xDragon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 51 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


well, im pretty sure i can still tenuki and live in there, so im going to take a big point, and it still puts a bit of pressure on w. im starting to look at my top left group and find a way to defend if i need it.


edit: fix move number


Last edited by xDragon on Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Lute
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #16 Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:06 pm 
Beginner

Posts: 19
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 0
Rank: KGS fake 4 kyu
Dusk Eagle wrote:
To add to what explo said, this is very bad for white to tenuki. It does not threaten to kill the top-left corner (no move does) and black gets so much in sente...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 50 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X y y . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X y y X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X y y y W W X O O X X y y y y y y |
$$ | . . X y y y 3 1 O 2 . O 5 y y y y y y |
$$ | . . . y y y . . 6 . 4 . . . . y y y y |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The one thing I think these two players need to learn the most is to keep your groups healthy. Healthy does not equal alive. Healthy means your group cannot get pushed all over to the benefit of your opponent. But both players are currently taking big plays before urgent plays. If they were to stop doing this and focus on the weak groups they might improve by two stones.


Good point. It is a very apparent problem among this 6-9 kyu level.

The mindset is that big points are so easy to tell that they are big, these other moves require some reading and effort to find.


Black needs to reply directly in the corner for the same reasons, he is sure that he can live but he's giving W a great position to strengthen himself and take profit.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline schultz
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #17 Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 12:24 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 505
Location: Montana
Liked others: 80
Was liked: 62
Lute wrote:
Good point. It is a very apparent problem among this 6-9 kyu level.

The mindset is that big points are so easy to tell that they are big, these other moves require some reading and effort to find.

I find myself pretty much right in this range, and definitely one of the biggest problems I have.

Still, I was surprised to see xDragon not take advantage of whites tenuki to essentially do what explo laid out. Did he also miss it? Maybe I've had this pulled on me too many times in the past. :roll:

_________________
KGS: schultz [?].
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Perception
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #18 Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 12:00 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Sorry I haven't made a move in the past few days. I've got work to do on a project for school and I also have a final coming up for my psychology class. I'll try to find time sometime this week to make a move though.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Perception
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #19 Posted: Mon May 03, 2010 1:38 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 116
Liked others: 3
Was liked: 11
Rank: -
GD Posts: 55
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$cmove 52 b:1 w:0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . W . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X X X X . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't know this move might be stupid but I feel like an invasion would be too much. Playing closer to his wall feels like it would be too easy for him to cut the stone off, then I'd have to worry about it and my stones above.

The capping play here might give him more than I should be giving him but I'm not really sure. It feels safer and it reduces his influence. If he tries to cut it off from the top it will probably result in a fight, if he's more defensive I'll be able to build up more.

I'd like to kill his stone in the top right corner but without more support I don't know if I can do that yet.

I haven't had that much time to think about this even though it's been a long time since the last move so hopefully this isn't a big mistake.

Sorry for taking so long but I've been kind of busy. I've almost finished my project and my psychology final is a couple days away so I'll have more free time after that's all done.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline Aphelion
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #20 - Perception vs xDragon
Post #20 Posted: Tue May 04, 2010 2:18 pm 
Lives in sente
User avatar

Posts: 766
Liked others: 24
Was liked: 59
Rank: KGS 4 kyu
GD Posts: 227
KGS: Aphelion02
xDragon wrote:
well, im pretty sure i can still tenuki and live in there, so im going to take a big point, and it still puts a bit of pressure on w. im starting to look at my top left group and find a way to defend if i need it.



This to me sums up the biggest problem with both players so far. Just because you "can" tenuki, doesn't mean you should. If tenuking means you get sealed up to 2 measly points while the opponent gets insane thickness, then you probably "cannot" tenuki.

For me as a spectator its also rather frustrating to watch. I think if you played a stone, that means you had a thought, a purpose there, and you owe it to yourself to demonstrate and continue with that purpose. If your just skipping around the board without regard for your original intent, then you can't really formulate any long term strategy. In a sense I feel like you have an "obligation" to your stones, and not fulfilling that is rather irresponsible.
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 1 of 3
  [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

Board index » L19²GO (Malkovich) » 1-on-1 Malkovich games

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group