Just a thought. I've worked both as a volunteer and with volunteers. You need to bear in mind that volunteers are not independent, and need to be managed, and this can be time-consuming. Any group with volunteers reaches a point when they have enough people volunteering, and don't want more because it can actually cost a lot of time to work with them.

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My blog about Macs and more: Kirkville

This is an understatement. I myself have worked numerous years at Florida's largest anime convention(worst idea ever). Herding volunteers is a very difficult task in large numbers.

As to stay on topic, my opinion on this only comes in with the lapsed year, I'm the kind of guy who will forget something if it's not automatically taken out of my bank account each month. Perhaps a better idea would to setup an automatic payment method. I'm not a member yet so I have no idea really what's done and what's not yet.

I most certainly think that the people who should and can qualify to represent the AGA in international tournaments shouldn't have an issue finding 10 games.

As a weak player, i'd happy to see pros come to play high dans and in return those high dans could play low dans and low dans play us. Like what's on kgs teaching ladder.

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长考出臭棋.

If you are interested in having some icecream, but not interested in going to icecream shop to buy it, then... you just won't have it. Oh, you can make it home, so here's the other solution, you hold an international tournament yourself.

There are many requirements of a person to represent an orgnization, not only in Go. In CJK countries, many tournaments are only open to pros, will you ask why 'only pros'? Some amateurs nowadays play as well as pros. Do you look at it as a punishment to those stronger amateurs? I think 10 games rule isn't a very tough thing to accomplish.

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长考出臭棋.

To try to summarize what I said before, it was my thought that the goal of the AGA was to promote the game of go in the USA. I do not believe that this requires forcing people to be in the AGA, and could perhaps more effectively be achieved by having less restrictions on tournament participation.

So to go with your analogy, if the goal of the ice cream shop was to get everybody in the country ice cream, they could very well provide ice cream to people that didn't drive into their shop. In the topic at hand, this doesn't have to cost the "ice cream shop" anything.

If the goal of the AGA is to promote go in the USA, I think reducing restrictions rather than creating them is a better way to do it.

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be immersed

Many others either go to icecream shop for the icecream tasting (tournaments), or simply make icecream themselves at home(whatever chinese or korean clubs). Why is someone so special to ask the icecream shop to do a speicial delivery to his/her door? Especially this icecream isn't the normal one that everybody can have. It's unique one made by the icecream company from Italy. Because the shop wants to promote icecream? Then it's reasonable that the shop decide to give this voucher to someone who regularly go to there icecream tastings or product presentations. Otherwise why don't the shop just deliever it anywhere say, your 5k neighbour? Or someone who never heard about icecream? Here's ur ticket to Italy, surely you won't get the prize, but at least you'll know how top icecream is made? Our goal is to promote icecream, we don't care the prize.

btw, what do you think about the tournaments that only open to pro that i mentioned in the last post? punishment to amateurs?

Yes, yes, the AGA is keen to promote this game. But the one who wants 'free-tickets' isn't aming at promote this game.

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长考出臭棋.

Well that is a surprise...

John Fairbairn:

I think you managed to take this off on a very disturbing tangent.

This is not about the volunteers or their time. We're not talking about an additional tournament, we're talking about bringing 20-30 people to an existing tournament. And whatever hours are associated with setting up the trip, are hours that would have been spent even if those people were not there.

The money I referred to would go directly to the prize fund.

Please don't sidetrack us into the volunteer discussion again when there's no good reason to. The non-volunteers inevitably say something accidentally which the volunteers take personally.

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Tactics yes, Tact no...

It's not a requirement by the ice cream shop to do this, of course. But it depends on the ice cream shop's goal. If we can get people that wouldn't normally go to the ice cream shop to eat ice cream, I think it's a great thing.

Hopefully my neighbors start eat ice cream, too, even if they can't drive into the shop. Then I can talk with them about ice cream and how we both like it.

What I'm talking about is that I believe the ice cream - and the fact that people have it - is bigger and more important than the ice cream shop.

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be immersed

Okay people, lets not delve too deeply into the ice cream metaphor, it doesn't really apply.

For one, these people would pay more for the possible access to the prize, they're not getting anything for free.

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Tactics yes, Tact no...

Yes, good point. That's a difference between his analogy and what we're talking about.

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be immersed

I find the idea that the volunteers in the AGA "do not care" or "do not want to promote go" to be extremely insulting. Different people have different ideas of how best to promote go, but I can guarantee that no one giving as much time as the volunteers in the AGA do would do so if they did not love the game and want to spread the game.

Are there new and better ways of doing so? Almost certainly. If anyone here has such an idea, they should either put it into action themselves (as the creators of IgoLocal and GoClubsOnline have done), they should speak to their AGA regional representative (I guarantee also that these people are interested in hearing from any go player, and not only from current AGA members), or they could take the incentive to join the AGA and to accomplish their goals from within.

I think that the airing of ideas is extremely worthwhile, but I find it extremely insulting that people who have not taken the incentive to "break into the club," which is actually extremely easy to do if one tries, are insulting those who love the game of go, who want to promote the game, and who want to make it easier for anyone who wants to play a game in person to find an opponent.

To be honest, I'm actually with Kirby on this one. Its not necessarily easy to "break into the club" -- but it can be done. It takes a lot of persistence, and thick skin (and from personal experience, complaining that you can't get in doesn't help, in fact it tends to have the opposite effect). It also helps to come to the Go Congresses and meet people in person.

Man, another reason I've gotta go to congress one of these years!

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be immersed

but if youre at congress, who will post on the forum all day?

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Decisions are made by those who show up.
and possibly those willing to attend secret meetings in ancient basements

I'll probably be able to manage if they have wifi...

I've tried to quit posting so much before, but it never works.

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be immersed

Next year! I think I can finally make it, so you should go, too!

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Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].

Well, let's hope they have wifi, because with *both* of us gone from the forums, the site traffic will definitely be too low!

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be immersed

The internet as a whole will breathe a sigh of relief when released from my constant midkyu ramblings. =D Perhaps our absence will finally give the internet time to... repaint the nodes?

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Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].

You see this in kindergarten every day. Four kids building a Lego castle and a fifth one wants to butt in. The foursome don't want their castle destroyed. No. 5 bursts into tears but goes off and does his own thing. The other kids finish their own project and wander over, like what they see and join in. No. 5 beams and they all remain pals (though protective mums allowed to watch may bare their fangs).

Maybe it's not just in go that the tiny tots have something to teach us.