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Offline RBerenguel
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #61 Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:45 pm 
Gosei
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Posts: 1585
Location: Barcelona, Spain (GMT+1)
Liked others: 577
Was liked: 298
Rank: KGS 5k
KGS: RBerenguel
Tygem: rberenguel
Wbaduk: JohnKeats
Kaya handle: RBerenguel
Online playing schedule: KGS on Saturday I use to be online, but I can be if needed from 20-23 GMT+1
Isn't white getting too much thickness on the left? And the sequence Yithril has planned ends in gote, so even worse?

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #62 Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:47 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
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Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X 2 . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline yithril
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #63 Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:49 pm 
Lives in gote
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Posts: 350
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Was liked: 33
Rank: 4 dan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #64 Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 10:37 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
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Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
i think white is ok so far.
i will let him make next decision and act accordingly.

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #65 Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:13 pm 
Gosei
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These are the two moves I am considering for black.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X 5 . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . 5 . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline yithril
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #66 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 8:47 am 
Lives in gote
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Rank: 4 dan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Sorry I actually forgot about the game. Hope you're still there!
Sorry about that, had a lot of stuff to take care of. I'm going to reinforce the right side. The upper left is a ko.

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #67 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:06 pm 
Tengen
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Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
i am still here.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
probe..
i will make my invasion after he decide how to attack my probe.

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The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #68 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:17 pm 
Gosei
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@Magicwand
Where would you have played :b35: ?


@Yithril
What were some other contenders for :b35: ?

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Offline Eizero
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #69 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:08 pm 
Dies in gote

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white has a lot of aji in the bottom right... For example later on Of course black could probably defend better but these are just examples

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X 9 . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 7 . 3 2 . . . . 8 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . 6 . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X 7 . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 5 . 3 2 . . 8 . 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #70 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:27 pm 
Tengen
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KGS: magicwand
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Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Loon
What he played is good
But I would play is Q14. It is not necessary better but I would have harder time to find invasion point

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The greater the unknown"
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Offline EdLee
 Post subject:
Post #71 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:30 pm 
Honinbo
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Magicwand,
Magicwand wrote:
But I would play is Q14.
Q14 = :b35:. Did you mean R14?
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Offline mitsun
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #72 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:47 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 553
Liked others: 61
Was liked: 250
Rank: AGA 5 dan
Ko in the upper left corner:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . 5 . . . . . . . . .
$$ | 4 1 3 X . . . . . . .
$$ | . 2 6 X O . O . . . .
$$ | 8 X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | 7 X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . O . 1 4 . . . . . .
$$ | X O O X 2 3 . . . . .
$$ | . X X X O . O . . . .
$$ | X X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | O X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | 5 O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]

This post by mitsun was liked by: jts
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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re:
Post #73 Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:10 am 
Tengen
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Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
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Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
EdLee wrote:
Magicwand,
Magicwand wrote:
But I would play is Q14.
Q14 = :b35:. Did you mean R14?

sorry i was using my android to reply and screen was too small :)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

i can not say this is better for black but i would have headache to find a way to invade with this shape.
shape is something that i am not used to so invasion point is not obvious to many.

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The greater the unknown"
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Offline yithril
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #74 Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 7:30 pm 
Lives in gote
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Rank: 4 dan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 7 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X O O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . O . . . , . . . . O , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . O . . X . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


@Loons
The one space jump was the only move that appeared in my mind.

Pincer seems perfectly natural here.

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #75 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 1:32 am 
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@mitsun:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . 4 . . . . . . . . .
$$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . .
$$ | . 3 . X O . O . . . .
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | 6 X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Any mileage in this way?
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #76 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:32 am 
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@ topazg
Wouldn't White then continue with 7, forcing Black into a less advantageous ko than before?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . 4 . . . . . . . . .
$$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . .
$$ | 8 3 7 X O . O . . . .
$$ | 9 X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | 6 X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #77 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:43 am 
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@intrepid:

Quite right. I was thinking Black has miai, but he should probably take :w7: in yours first.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . 4 . a . . . . . . .
$$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . .
$$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . .
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Because of "a", I'm struggling to see how White can restrict Black's liberties enough to create a ko..
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #78 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:00 am 
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@topazg
This should work, it seems:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . 4 . 7 . . . . . . .
$$ | 5 1 2 X 8 9 . . . . .
$$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . .
$$ | . X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ --------------------------
$$ | . X . O 1 . . . . . .
$$ | O O X X X O . . . . .
$$ | . O X X O . O . . . .
$$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Edit: Never mind, this does not work ... hmm

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Last edited by The Intrepid on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #79 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:02 am 
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@Intrepid:

Are you sure?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ --------------------------
$$ | a X b O 1 . . . . . .
$$ | O O X X X O . . . . .
$$ | . O X X O . O . . . .
$$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X .
$$ | 3 X O O . . . . . . .
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$[/go]


Now what? White can't play at "a", and so after "b" Black is unconditionally alive?
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: Yithril vs. Magicwand
Post #80 Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:03 am 
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Just realized this myself :D

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