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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #61 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:21 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm28
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . 1 . O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The variation topazg chose seems inferior to the one I suggested. There are five pro games (most recent one in 2008, and all five continued according to the variation I showed. Time to punish. :mrgreen:

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Offline EdLee
 Post subject:
Post #62 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:33 am 
Honinbo
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Maybe tenuki.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . W . O X . . . . . . . . . 1 . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #63 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 7:13 am 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm28
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . 1 . O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


That was careless, I should have played the atari instead of the descent like I'd meant to initially. This squeeze is very annoying:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm28
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 5 X X X O X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . 1 2 6 X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . 7 3 4 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


As a result, playing here next is only perhaps 7 or so points gote, which is endgame, so I'm going to ignore it and play elsewhere instead.
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Offline Dragon Pie
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #64 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:40 pm 
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Now Topazg's bottom left group looks ripe for the attacking.
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Offline skydyr
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #65 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:59 pm 
Oza

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topazg wrote:
As a result, playing here next is only perhaps 7 or so points gote, which is endgame, so I'm going to ignore it and play elsewhere instead.

I think there may be a counting mistake here, as black is not counting what white can gain with another play, which seems more than 7 points, as he can capture the stones and corner outright and threaten to take more in sente on the bottom. As Dragon Pie said, as well, white can also threaten the safety of the black group as a whole now.
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #66 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:17 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm30
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X . . . , . . . 1 . , . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Those three stones in the bottom-left corner are big because, if I take them, the neighboring three Black stones become significantly weaker. However, responding to the kakari is bigger.

If topazg gets around to play first in the bottom left, I can choose between a risk-free squeeze or a ko:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Choice 1
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . O O O O . . .
$$ | 2 X X X O X . .
$$ | . O 1 O X . . .
$$ | . . 3 . X . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ -----------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Choice 2
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . O O O O . . .
$$ | 3 X X X O X . .
$$ | . O 1 O X . . .
$$ | 6 5 2 4 X . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ -----------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm7 Choice 2
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . .
$$ | . O O O O . . .
$$ | X X X X O X . .
$$ | 1 C X O X . . .
$$ | O X O O X . . .
$$ | . 2 . . . . . .
$$ -----------------[/go]

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Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #67 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:25 pm 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm30
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O X . . . , . . . 1 . , . . . |
$$ | . O 2 O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I misread - that squeeze doesn't work, and hence this is bigger than I'd thought. White has to connect first, and Black can descend, so not only is it slightly smaller in terms of points, it's also richer in eyeshape (which is concerning me with regards to the priority along the lower side). I also have a habit of realising a mistake, and abandoning areas just to find the mistake got a lot worse.I also realised that wD2 is really very sente ...

So I'm happy treating my last move as sort of kikashi. I'm quite happy for the fun that could ensue if White invades on the right now, although I consider both that and M3 really big moves to get next (partly because M3 increases the aji of moves like Q3 which I've always enjoyed in this position), so I'll try to recover this corner here and then pick a global plan off White's next move.
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #68 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:39 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 1 X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I'd need to win the ko a few times too many for it to be worthwhile. Moreover, if I lose the ko, my moyo on the left would get hurt (from underneath). Next, I intend to approach the top right corner, lest Black's moyo becomes too big.

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #69 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 7:20 pm 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 1 X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . 2 . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Great, now this corner is secure. Let's see whether White wants to attack my Q6 stone or not.
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #70 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 7:59 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm34
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . 1 , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Ideally, I'll get sente here. One possible variaton:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$----------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 4 5 . |
$$ , X . . . O . 1 6 . |
$$ . . . . . . . 7 . . |
$$ . . . . . 2 X . . . |
$$ . . . . . 3 . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm8
$$----------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 3 1 . |
$$ . . . . . . 2 O X . |
$$ , X . . . O 4 X O . |
$$ . . . . . . . X 5 . |
$$ . . . . . O X . 6 . |
$$ . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm14
$$----------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . 3 O O . |
$$ . . . . . 4 X O X . |
$$ , X . . . O X X O . |
$$ . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ . . . . . O X 2 X . |
$$ . . . . . X . 1 . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #71 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:44 pm 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm34
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . 1 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I've built the outside position for some tricksiness here if I give him the corner ... we'll see if my reading is off
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #72 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:09 pm 
Lives in gote

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm36
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
This reverts to the standard 3-4 invasion under a 4-4 stone. topazg really seems to like his 4-4 stones. :) Anyway, living should not be too difficult, but it'd be nice to get influence toward the right side. My next move is what's going to be difficult.

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #73 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:44 am 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm36
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . 1 2 . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #74 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:20 am 
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Some variations. :)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . 5 , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 3 X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . 1 2 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


:b35: connects. Now :w36: continues as in the game.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . 9 , a . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 2 X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | 6 O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | 5 4 1 3 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 8 7 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


:w42: at "a".

In this variation White makes ko. He gains more with the second move in the top right than he loses on the left side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm32
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | 5 O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 2 X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | 6 O X O X 7 9 a . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . 4 1 3 X 8 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


:w42: at "a".

Another variation.

_________________
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins

Visualize whirled peas.

Everything with love. Stay safe.


Last edited by Bill Spight on Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
This post by Bill Spight was liked by: The Intrepid
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Offline drmwc
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #75 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:22 am 
Lives in gote
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W 28 appears to be a mistake due to the variations Bill gave.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm28
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . . , X . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | 3 X X X O X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . 5 2 O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . 1 4 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The diagonal move avoids the ko possibilities and looks better for W.

This post by drmwc was liked by 2 people: Bill Spight, illluck
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #76 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:34 am 
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@Bill Spight
I saw the ko variation (I posted it earlier), but isn't the problem that I'd have to win it 3 times? That said, the second variation looks interesting.

As for my next move, I am contemplating to start some complications via something like this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$----------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ , X . . . O X . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

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Offline illluck
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #77 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:05 am 
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@drmwc:
Thanks! I remember the kosumi being better but couldn't recall why XD


The idea of tenuki on top right makes me feel like The Intrepid is overthinking this again. Surely there's nothing more urgent.
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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #78 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:31 am 
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It is true that the ko is a two step ko. But it is still big, and it is a picnic ko for White. :)

Oops! Edited Black to White. ;)

_________________
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins

Visualize whirled peas.

Everything with love. Stay safe.


Last edited by Bill Spight on Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #79 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:29 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm38
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X X . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . 1 , X . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X X O X . . . , . . . O . , . . . |
$$ | . O X O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
All right, let's stir the pot. I aim to cut at e17 as well as to apply pressure against Black stone on L16.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . a X X . . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O , B . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

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Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
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Offline The Intrepid
 Post subject: Re: #205: The Intrepid vs. topazg: The Pistols
Post #80 Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:33 pm 
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Bill Spight wrote:
It is true that the ko is a two step ko. But it is still big, and it is a picnic ko for Black. :)

My lack of understanding shows here, I suppose, for fighting the ko seemed unnecessarily risky.

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