The future of KGS

[Pippen]

Where does WMS see KGS in 5 years? Is it set or will there be major developments & changes coming up? What would u like? I definitely would love to see KGS continue for a looong time since IMHO it's the best Go-Server, a Server where I found many nice people and conversations whereas on other server you can "just" play....

[Uberdude]

Are you aware he is working on an html client?

[Pippen]

Are you aware he is working on an html client?

Nope. Does this change anything more than that the client will be able to run through a webbrowser? Like ranking, graphics and so on?

[Javaness2]

The HTML 5 client might let us have some cool new stuff, if it's robust enough.

[Pippen]

Ah..ok. I thought if you program in HTML you basically wanna create a server that is reachable through a webrowser.

[wineandgolover]

Hmmm, I love KGS. I play 99% of my online games there.

But, "is working on an HTML client" and "might let us have cool new stuff" are a step or two below vaporware on the software readiness list.

If WMS is still full-time employed, and not accepting coding assistance, then I'd moderate expectations for timing and features. I would very much love to be proven wrong and I hope that WMS is practicing the mantra, "under-promise and over-deliver."

[quantumf]

The cost benefit analysis eludes me. To make a client as functionally capable and as stable and bug-free as the existing cgoban client will be a pretty epic task. And for what, exactly? It might silence the vocal anti-java minority, but I can't think of a legitimate reason, except perhaps to fight off the challenge of Kaya and others. Kaya and others are not mounting any immediate challenge, but I suppose there's always the risk that when they eventually get a compelling alternative, it will be too late to do anything about it. But then I wonder if wms even cares that much. Since it's not his primary source of income, perhaps he will even welcome a credible english language alternative and can retire from the stress of running kgs.

[Phelan]

The cost benefit analysis eludes me. To make a client as functionally capable and as stable and bug-free as the existing cgoban client will be a pretty epic task. And for what, exactly? It might silence the vocal anti-java minority, but I can't think of a legitimate reason, except perhaps to fight off the challenge of Kaya and others. Kaya and others are not mounting any immediate challenge, but I suppose there's always the risk that when they eventually get a compelling alternative, it will be too late to do anything about it. But then I wonder if wms even cares that much. Since it's not his primary source of income, perhaps he will even welcome a credible english language alternative and can retire from the stress of running kgs.

I think the idea is that people have always wanted to play on KGS through college/corporate firewalls, or systems that can't use java. An HTML client would work for that. I don't know if he ever gave reasons.
By the way, I think he had a page on google plus detailing the progress on that, but don't remember the link.

[Samura]

I think the idea is that people have always wanted to play on KGS through college/corporate firewalls, or systems that can't use java. An HTML client would work for that. I don't know if he ever gave reasons.
By the way, I think he had a page on google plus detailing the progress on that, but don't remember the link.

Yes! The day I can play between my classes at college on my iPad will be a happy day!

[Uberdude]

The cost benefit analysis eludes me. To make a client as functionally capable and as stable and bug-free as the existing cgoban client will be a pretty epic task. And for what, exactly?

I imagine part of wms's reasons for doing it could be for his personal enjoyment and benefit: having fun programming, learning new technologies and skills (good CV fodder).

[Marathon]

I think another motivation is to reduce the number of clients, and therefore, the future work needed in making changes.

The current system's main client is the web-start client, with two versions (with or without file associations). Then, there is the applet (Java plugin) client. I imagine the applet client is substantially the same as the web-start, but with some features disabled (because browser/applet security prevents their use) and "life cycle management" methods. But then there is the Android client, which I imagine is completely different than the others. So, this project will essentially reduce the number of clients from two to one.

In addition, there is the GTP client for bots. I've no idea how that fits into the picture.

Also, it looks like the current server will remain, as he has said he is converting the existing client to act as an intermediate server. So, the HTML 5 client will communicate with the new server, and the new server will communicate with the current server.

[PaperTiger]

But then I wonder if wms even cares that much. Since it's not his primary source of income, perhaps he will even welcome a credible english language alternative and can retire from the stress of running kgs.

Considering that he hasn't gotten around to make a one line change to fix the stone clicking sounds in over a year, it is evident he really doesn't care.

[speedchase]

I think another motivation is to reduce the number of clients, and therefore, the future work needed in making changes.

The current system's main client is the web-start client, with two versions (with or without file associations). Then, there is the applet (Java plugin) client. I imagine the applet client is substantially the same as the web-start, but with some features disabled (because browser/applet security prevents their use) and "life cycle management" methods. But then there is the Android client, which I imagine is completely different than the others. So, this project will essentially reduce the number of clients from two to one.

I really don't think that is it. Java is generally considered much easier to maintain than HTML because there is only one JRE (well here are more but no one really cares if you support the others or not) while there are tons of browsers, and way more comparability issues.

[Kirby]

The cost benefit analysis eludes me. To make a client as functionally capable and as stable and bug-free as the existing cgoban client will be a pretty epic task. And for what, exactly?...

Say it's the 90s, oh about the time that KGS was initially being developed. Making a go server and client functionally capable and stable would have been a pretty epic task. And for what, exactly?

Anyway, the most pressing reason to have a browser client is to stay modern, in my opinion. KGS is cool, and was pretty well designed, but it does have an old feel to it.

[deja]

I've been away from Go (and L19) for some time, so this may be a dumb question, but is there a better or even equivalent client for teaching? For all its warts, it still seems to be the most versatile compared to the others.