First off, this game is still in progress.
I will be posting parts of the game which are interesting for discussion and keep adding to it as the game progresses.

I recently started playing a really slow game with a friend of mine. He is slightly stronger than me, so he took white with no komi.
My goal was not to win, but to play following the principles that I know to be good practise in go. If I fail, it is because I wasn't able to back it up with reading or I overestimated the value of a bad move or underestimated the value of a good move.

I'd like to hear your opinion of the level of this game as wel as a review of the moves that we played so far.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 , 4 . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Moves 1 and 3: I'm usually a territorial player and open up with the double 3-4 opening as black. Recently I started playing handicap games and I felt really uncomfortable with the 4-4 stones so I decided to play them and try to use them properly.

Move 4: This surprised me, I was expecting something like D17 or D16. When I took my time to think about this move, I realised that it's a bit tricky to play around it.

Move 5: I figured that invading the corner directly would be exactly what white wanted and I'd end up giving him a lot of outside influence which he could then use with his stone at D4 or approach at O17. So I decided to play patiently and make a corner enclosure threatening to extend and build a framework aswel as negating SOME of the potential for white at the top.

Move 7: With my enclosure in place, I decided it was safe to go into the corner now because white can't approach the corner at the top anymore.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . 1 , O . . . . , . . . . . X . 0 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . 4 . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 6 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 2: I was a bit taken aback that he ignored me coming into the corner, but it makes sense now that I have an extra stone at the top

Move 3: Since there were 2 single stones on the right side, I decided to pincer. I pincered high because I wanted flexibility and potentially create the biggest wall I have ever seen on the right side which I can then use to attack anything and invade anywhere :p

Move 6: I was really happy that he went into the corner because it makes my group really thick and I can then use that thickness to harass the R14 stone severely.

Move 10: I was a little bit frustrated by this because white now owes a move in the top left and bottom right. Move 4 leaves an open skirt which black can use to attack. With move 10, my plans to harass the R14 stone have gone pretty much out the window.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 4 2 . . |
$$ | . . X , O . . . . , . . . . 5 X . 0 . |
$$ | . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 1: It bothered me a little bit to approach from the side of my thickness but letting white settle with the standard joseki felt unsatisfying. I took some cash worth 16 points on the right side and forced white into the corner taking a really big wall pointing towards the top and center of the board. Since I'm a very territorial player, this goes against the grain for me. But I thought to myself, surely this wall is worth much more than the corner and letting white settle.

Move 4: This is a mistake, I know this for certain because my teacher has explained to me before that in this joseki, anything other than R14 as move 4 makes black stronger than he should be. This is reflected by many pro games in which this joseki featured. It still felt dissatisfying to let him take 10 points in the corner in sente.

Move 6: Grrrrr...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . a . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | 7 4 X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . 1 O 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 6 3 b . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Moves 1-8: This is normal joseki. But this joseki is slightly special in my opinion because it gives black the choice if he wants sente or not. Normally black would finish the joseki with the exchanges at black a and white b. If black doesn't finish the joseki, he can take sente and if white threatens the corner ignore it and make a ko in exchange for a good position everywhere else on the board.

Move 9: Tired of being pushed around I seize the initiative and decide to attack at 9. With the ladder being in place, I figured that if I can either sacrifice some stones to break the ladder, take something in the corner or attack white's O4 stone. Either way, it feels like a strong move. Especially because white didn't finish the shape as mentioned earlier in the second diagram.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 1 captured (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O 3 X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 1 O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . b 7 4 5 6 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 2: White sees the danger of cutting at 3 (read it out, he can't cut) so drops down at 2.

Move 5: I decided to cut on the inside of the corner because if white connects at 7 his shape will be eyeless and black can extend to 6 to capture 2 stones while destroying white's corner.

Move 6: I was really happy to see that white played atari on the inside, because my goal was to atari at 7 and then make the a and b exchange. White's 2 stones in the center are now floating against a super thick wall, black got to get some stones at the bottom area and it's not simple for white to capture the stones at 7 because if white jumps at M3, black can push and cut white.

Current score
White: 19,5 points in cash + potential on the left side.
Black: 21 points in cash + a really big wall facing the top side and the center. Also a weak white group to attack for profit.

I feel that black is "comfortably" ahead right now.

The next update will follow whenever we are another handful of moves further in the game, let the discussions start!

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 1 captured (me) vs White 1 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 9 7 6 O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 4 5 O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 0 3 1 O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 4: White wants to capture the 3 stones because if he can't, he'll get an abysmal result.

Move 5-7: Black has to push and cut because crawling on the second line is unacceptable.

Move 10: White captures the 3 black stones and black can use his sacrifice to make a strong position.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 2 captured (me) vs White 5 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . a . . . . . . . 3 . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 1 . 5 . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 4 . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Current score
White: 25,5 points in cash + potential on the left side.
Black: 30 points in cash + a really big wall facing the top side and the center.

I think I will play at a next. But I want to take some more time to think about the global position of the board before I do.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 2 captured (me) vs White 5 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . 1 6 . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . 5 4 8 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . 3 7 2 . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 1: Black has to make a moyo now because that's the only place he can effectively still make points. J16 makes a nice big moyo.

Move 2: White has no choice but to invade. I think this point isn't bad but I personally would have capped at J14.

Move 3: Black can't allow white to connect up to his strong stones on the left so a fight starts.

Move 4-7: Black tries to make white heavy and commit to the fight.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 2 captured (me) vs White 5 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . 6 . 3 4 . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . 2 X O . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . X X O . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 1: I decided to play the hane on the bottom because I felt that I would be able to either connect up or make life with the cutting stones near the top edge. If this is not the case, it's entirely my own fault for not reading deeply enough.

Move 2: I'm not sure how I feel about this move because white doesn't have a lot of space to fight in. But then again, white is thick on the left side also and blacks stones are closer to whites thickness than whites stones are to blacks thickness.

Move 3-5: This sequence is to be expected.

For the next move I'm very conflicted. White has "miai" here because if black connects underneath at K18, white will push into blacks influence. This should be what black wants but feels very uncomfortable due to the cut at J13. But if black fixes his shape at J12 white will kill off the black stones with K18.

I feel black has a better fight than white here though because the ladder works for black, G18 makes at least 1 eye and black can connect up underneath.

Current score
White: 29,5 points in cash + potential on the left side.
Black: 23 points in cash + a really big wall facing a weak white group to attack for profit.

If black can make some points in sente while attacking white he will be ahead, if white lives with points, white will be ahead.

I think this Joseki may be a bad choice because you have a strong wall on th right but then you give him counter influence here?




This seems like overplay to me, no need to invade anywhere yet, and in particular this one looks too hard to do right now.

[/quote]

I really don't think this fight is good for black. Even if your two stones don't die I don't see any gain, instead after just tenuki? Leave the aji

I don't think this result is good for black personally, you got rid of whites aji and gave him points for that kinda iffy shape?



Don't count like that. Right now white is the one with 25 solid points, but you have only 10 solid points in the top left.

Black also has large wall and area of influence on the right.
White has influence on the left and a 4-4.

Don't count points that you are not sure of, the right is not secure and you do not know how many points the wall will bring in.

The game is about even though, but don't count territory that may or may not be, it leads to bad habits.

Hm, I disagree that the right is not secure. I'm pretty sure that the right side is at least 18 points of solid territory that cannot be invaded. And the top left isn't 10 points either because white can reduce it in sente. But other than that, you might be right about the lower right side where I remove the aji eventhough it's not invading. I was aiming at outside influence or at least get a big corner if he chose to take the outside instead. Either way, I would have gotten some profit in the lower right side. But the timing might be incorrect. Either way, I had the ladder in the top left and white had an unsettled shape in the lower right, to me it felt like it was time to take the profit he owed me by not fixing his bad aji. What would you have suggested?

The joseki choice in the top left seems fine to me, however, I would like to know what you would suggest instead of the joseki I played. It's easy to say "this is wrong" when you don't have to give a right way.

Thanks for the comments though.

Continuation of the game:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 2 captured (me) vs White 5 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 5 7 8 . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . 6 . 3 4 . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . 2 X O . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . X X O . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Move 1: It looks like the place where black would be able to escape or make eyes the most easily was towards the center, so the hane at the bottom aims to take profit from the moyo that is already built aswel as limiting white's escaping options. It feels a bit counter intuitive though because when you're fighting the general rule is to push your opponent into your thickness. I did read it out though.

Move 2: As expected, but I'm not sure if this was the right decision seeing as white is strengthening blacks stone by pushing it into his weak group. I would have played the atari from the other side to make eyeshape.

Moves 3-5: Natural continuation

Move 7: After reading it out, I knew black could either connect at the bottom or kill some of whites stones, so connecting the stones that have the least amount of space felt like it was the most urgent move.

Move 8: This was overplay I think. White tries to capture the black stones with a weak group.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 2 captured (me) vs White 5 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X O 2 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . O . X O 1 6 9 X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . O X O 4 5 d . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . X O O 7 c . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . X X O 3 . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . a X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . b . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

at

Move 1-9: White is just captured. After the exchanges of a,b and c,d white resigned.

It was a bit of an anti-climax at the end because I really felt this could have been a really exciting and close game but oh well. It wasn't getting much attention on L19 anyway ^_^

Sorry it's too hard on an iPod to post a move. It took like 15 mins just to write what I did above xd.

But one quick thing, k16 should be farther because you have influence. If you hav influence you extend huge, even though he has influence here as well you shôuld challenge that.

Still nice win ^^

If I get on a pc this weekend ill finish my posts. Sorry if they seemed harsh.

Thanks, looking forward to it

[quote="foeZ"]Hm, I disagree that the right is not secure. I'm pretty sure that the right side is at least 18 points of solid territory that cannot be invaded. And the top left isn't 10 points either because white can reduce it in sente. But other than that, you might be right about the lower right side where I remove the aji eventhough it's not invading. I was aiming at outside influence or at least get a big corner if he chose to take the outside instead. Either way, I would have gotten some profit in the lower right side. But the timing might be incorrect. Either way, I had the ladder in the top left and white had an unsettled shape in the lower right, to me it felt like it was time to take the profit he owed me by not fixing his bad aji. What would you have suggested?

The joseki choice in the top left seems fine to me, however, I would like to know what you would suggest instead of the joseki I played. It's easy to say "this is wrong" when you don't have to give a right way. [\quote]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black 1 captured (me) vs White 1 captured (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . Y . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X M . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . M . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , M . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . Y . . . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

There is alot of aji on the marked places. I would have gone to either one of these places, probably the top though.


Also for the earlier joseki.. I would just try anything else, for instance... this one is the one eidogo has other than what you did.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 5 4 . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | . 7 X 6 O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . 1 O 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

while this result also kinda doesn't make a good use of your wall, it is better I think personally... however I might say just this is better to begin with:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc Black (me) vs White (my friend) with 0,5 komi
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | . . X , O . 2 . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . M 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If he tries to take the stone you get the outside easily, and then there is that aji.. not sure.

Some thoughts:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 1 . 5 . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . b . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . a . . O . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 4 . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I don't like this result for you. lower right, which had a lot of aji before, is now rock solid territory for white (and could be as much as 25 points is W gets a and b). White also gets to take the ponnuki at 6, a huge move in this type of position. It makes W thick, which means W can be aggreseive in reducing B's moyo.

Your compensation for all this was the ponnuki and sente. I find it hard to value the ponnuki, but I believe it's too small to compensate for the loss.

Why didn't you play at 6 with 5? It creates a fight, which is likely to make your thickness very effective.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c My suggestion
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X 5 7 . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . 6 O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 1 O . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X X O O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 4 . O . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Black gets a powerful attack this way - it's a lot better than the game. However, W could avoid this by catpuring the single stone with move 4 - there is no need to caputre the 3 stones yet.

Therefore, going back further, I suggest:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c Better move?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . O O . . |
$$ | X . X , O . . . . , . . . . X X . O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X b . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . 1 . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Black 1 below make miai of a and b, and is therefore a powerful move.