Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

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Shinkenjoe
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Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

Hi there.

Im working through All about L&D again. I try to look at some deviations of the explained main lines and wanted to have a place where i can put some doubtful insights, so others can have my doubts too.

Im beginning with a standard fail attack on the haned L+1 Group with leg on the short side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------
$$ | 5 . . b X . .
$$ | 2 1 X X O O .
$$ | 3 a X O . . .
$$ | 4 X X O . . .
$$ | . O O O . . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]
Now black can choose between a and b, the book suggests (a), but (b) looked more natural to me, so I wanted to prove it inferior.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W :b2: elsewhere
$$ --------------
$$ | O . . 3 X . .
$$ | c O X X O O .
$$ | O X X O . . .
$$ | X X X O . . .
$$ | 1 O O O . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]
And now :b4: at c fights the ko: An one approach move ko
If White plays at 3 first :
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W :b4: at :b2: and :w5: at :w3:
$$ --------------
$$ | O 2 3 1 X . .
$$ | . O X X O O .
$$ | O X X O . . .
$$ | X X X O . . .
$$ | . O O O . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W Lives in double ko
$$ --------------
$$ | O . O 6 X . .
$$ | . O X X O O .
$$ | O X X O . . .
$$ | X X X O . . .
$$ | . O O O . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]


The other variant with b in the first diagram:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W :b4: elsewhere :b6: fights the ko
$$ --------------
$$ | O 2 3 X X 5 .
$$ | . O X X O O .
$$ | O . X O . . .
$$ | X X X O . . .
$$ | 1 O O O . . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]

In both cases we have an approach move ko and the only difference is the sacrifice point at :b2:.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by jts »

I suspect this is the problem with "b":

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ --------------
$$ | 5 7 . 6X . .
$$ | 2 1 X X O O .
$$ | 3 a X O . . .
$$ | 4 X X O . . .
$$ | . O O O . . .
$$ | . . . . . . .[/go]
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

Yay, I somehow missed that one. Thx
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Interesting fight in a nonsense game

Post by Shinkenjoe »

One of my late night games ended in an interesting fight.
I sure did some serious bad thing to let me split that easily. I tried to get my way out somehow and tried every turn.
At move 93 my opponent somehow stumbled. I tried to find the right answer afterwards, but only with mediocre results.

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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by jts »

That's a funny game - what a dumpling black got!

30 and 32 seem a bit sheepish. There's no sense in giving atari at B13 if you don't plan to play the ko, right? After 32, you've taken gote twice, but you've gotten a worse result than if you had, for example, played B13 at B12.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

A game again. The Tides were turning often as we both blundered much. The end was still close.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

Today one game from the category "Get strong at losing graceful". See yourself.


Finally lost at move 185 after the tide turning 2 times :D.

Also played my first kgs after some years.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

Im doing the graded Go problems 3 at the moment, cause i only want to bruise through problems right now and am too lazy to think hard. Still funny what mistakes i can make with these ddk problems. Today I had to stop and think at one problem for fifteen minutes to get it wrong after all. :(

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B weak carpenters
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O X X . . . , . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


I came up with 2 "solutions"

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B 2 and 3 can be ommited ?
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . 6 . 0 9 . . . . . |
$$ | 7 1 5 O 2 3 . . . . |
$$ | . 4 . O X . X . . . |
$$ | 8 O O X X . . . , . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B Soulution 2 11 at a
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . 5 . 6 a . . . . . |
$$ | 9 1 4 O 3 . . . . . |
$$ | 8 2 . O X . X . . . |
$$ | 7 O O X X . . . , . |
$$ | 0 X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


I thought the first to be better cause no outside assumptions are needed one space down left. I looked at the solution and mine wasn't there. (deviation at :b5: at soution 1). If you like, refute.
My tries are somewhat doubtful, like always at these damn corners. :D
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Refutation ?
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . 5 b . . . . . . . |
$$ | 4 1 3 O a . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 . O X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O X X . . . , . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]

With :b5: at a and b it eventually becomes a ko with white takin first. But i had a hard time with 5.

If white tries like below the points are miai

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W 1 and 2 miai
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O 2 O X . X . . . |
$$ | 1 O O X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


Escape route can't be blocked without ko, so you gott let white run.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W ko with :b4: threating kill at :b5:
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . X 5 . 3 . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O 1 2 . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . X . . . |
$$ | 4 O O X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


This as the best refutation. Either I miss something again or its a bit hard for maybe 12 kyus.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W escaping
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . X . . 7 5 . . . . |
$$ | O X X O 1 4 3 9 . . |
$$ | . O 2 O X 6 X . . . |
$$ | 8 O O X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

I hate it losin drunk to guys 5 stones worse than me ten times in a row.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

I thihk this game was intersting as there was a big trade and a messy fight, but it was just a 10 min blitz so no deep thoughts in it.



P.S.: had to correct the most embarrasing typose ^^
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

I really had problems against the 8 kyus on wbaduk, but now i beat up the 6 kyu's like i did with the nerds in school. must be a mood thing. Today winnig is fashion, Maybe tomorrow is a losin day.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

Problem from Graded Go Problems
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ +-------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O X X O O . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O X , . . . X , . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . O O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +-------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ +-------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O X X O O . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . a . O . . |
$$ | . O X , . . 1 X , . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . O O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +-------------------------+[/go]

Solution says a lives. Fine. I think :b1: also live is just 3 points smaller.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

I now also see a solution to one of my older problems:


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ +---------------------+
$$ | . X 4 . 3 . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O 1 2 . . . . |
$$ | . O 6 O X . X . . . |
$$ | 5 O O X X . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------+[/go]


and white can't approach.
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by CnP »

Shinkenjoe wrote:Problem from Graded Go Problems
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ +-------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O X X O O . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O X , . . . X , . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X . O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . O O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +-------------------------+[/go]



I don't think your solution works, since White could play as:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ +-------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O O X X O O . . . |
$$ | . O X X X 3 2 4 . O . . |
$$ | . O X , a . 1 X , . . . |
$$ | . . O X X X b O O . . . |
$$ | . . O . O O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +-------------------------+[/go]

and a and b are then miai to kill. Apologies if I've missed something
I am John. John-I-Am.
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Shinkenjoe
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Re: Shinkenjoe vs Free Time

Post by Shinkenjoe »

I don't think your solution works, since White could play as:


Yes. Thanks. I somehow was too blind for the b.
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