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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #61 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 12:31 pm 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 34, W: 21
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O W X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


This is so obviously odd, I'm suspicious. His hidden move is around here I suspect, and the best response if he has an extra stone is to connect everything. I'll see what he does next ..

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #62 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:58 pm 
Gosei
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That's his hidden move.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 34, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


What happens now? You go again?

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #63 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:04 pm 
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Phelan wrote:
That's his hidden move.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 34, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


What happens now? You go again?
Yeah, he gets to change his move.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #64 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:05 pm 
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Quote:
What happens now? You go again?


Yes, white can try again. There basically is an automatic undo, and the hidden stone gets revealed.

*edit. MountainGo beat me to it by les than 60 sec :lol:

* making it a useful post:

for spectators only

White can play 1 and hope to trick black with the hidden move.
the ladder looks to work, but thee is the hidden move to provide a nice ladder breaker.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 34, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . 5 X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . W X 3 @ 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O 2 . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . 1 . O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


after 5 game is pretty much over.
I hope this does not happen.

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Last edited by freegame on Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #65 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:10 pm 
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Aphelion wrote:
MountainGo, could you show your hidden stone in hide tags? Its really hard to follow the game without knowing.
Well, now you know. :) I thought it might be fun for people to try to guess based on my comments. I suppose next time I could put a spoiler within a spoiler. I just didn't want to put something like this in a post:

MY HIDDEN MOVE:
Not that I question topazg's honesty, but I think it could be hard for anyone to resist peeking--or just looking by accident.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #66 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:13 pm 
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I agree. Having to guess where the the hidden move is based on the players hidden comments is much more fun for the spectators.
This time it was so obvious that, if you had read the comments the players made that it was easy to guess the hidden move(s)

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #67 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:40 am 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 34, W: 21
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . W . O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


This game is crazy :(

Well, there we go, I'm in atari. So I extend, him capturing this stone is devastating, especially as I have a couple of tricks up my sleeve.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #68 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 8:44 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 35, W: 21
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . O B O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
This is what I expected. I now feel about 80% sure his stone is on G9. If it is, it seems likely I'll win this game, since we'll have about equal points on the board. I'll be aiming soon to try to solidly connect that probably half-cut kosumi, although if his stone is on G9, it seems very likely that he'll cut next move (which, if my reading is correct, turns out okay for me).

Diagram added:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . Q X m . . |
$$ | . . O 5 4 2 X 1 @ . . |
$$ | . . . 6 3 O X O . . . |
$$ | p . . 0 7 X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . 8 O B O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . 9 . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


Haha, twice I edited this post to erase what I had because I saw another move for White that could destroy me, but then I did some more reading and realized it turns out okay.


Last edited by MountainGo on Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:03 am, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #69 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 8:56 am 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 35, W: 22
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X . @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O W . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


This prevents him getting to force me onto the "m" point, and allows me to take that "p" point on the right edge, or at least make it hard for him to play there next move.


Ermm.... MountainGo, where did your move go? :S

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #70 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:14 am 
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@ MountainGo
MountainGo wrote:
(which, if my reading is correct, turns out okay for me)

Just a suggestion, but a diagram of your reading would have been nice for the spectators. now we still don't know what you thought/read


for spectators only
this last move also sets up the ladder.
because black has the wrong idea about the
hidden move, this could turn out quite nasty

however I think black might now play where the white hidden move is.
this seems like a reasonable move for black, had the hidden move not been there

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #71 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:58 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 36, W: 22
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X B @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X . p |
$$ | . X # X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
Nice move, Graham. I didn't see that coming. If I know where his stone is, he just set up a ladder to capture G8. This moves escapes it, although he'll be able to make me play the minus zone like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . b 0 . |
$$ | . . m O . . P X 6 7 . |
$$ | . . O . . 5 X B @ 8 a |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O 9 . |
$$ | p . . . 4 X O X X 1 p |
$$ | . X # X . 3 O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
etc.

My other main choice here is to play F8 myself, but then he gets to take a large upper-right corner.

I also have the option of sacrificing my stones in the upper right and probably forcing him to play the minus zone there, but I think that leaves him with a few more points as compared to this way.

Of course that all assumes my guess for his stone is right. But if I'm wrong, then I probably lose no matter what.

Again, I keep noticing new things when I'm about to post my move. I've probably stopped before hitting submit and gone back to Drago about 10 times on this move. I'm NOT just looking back over the same variations and being indecisive; I'm actually noticing new, important things that I'd missed. It stresses me out, and I'm really trying to learn how to just make a move without worrying about it.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #72 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:28 am 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 36, W: 23
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X W p |
$$ | . X # X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


Yay :) Now I get to atari and play to kill that whole Black group in a big way. This game is beginning to look really good for me if he connects.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #73 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:45 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 37, W: 23
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . . O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . B . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
What are the only three words in the English language that start with dw? They are all ordinary words that any native speaker would know.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #74 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:23 pm 
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MountainGo wrote:
What are the only three words in the English language that start with dw? They are all ordinary words that any native speaker would know.


I count four, but I am not a native speaker. One might be slang, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #75 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:54 pm 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 37, W: 24
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . . X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . W O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


Must.. win .. liberty race

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #76 Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 2:15 pm 
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Harleqin wrote:
MountainGo wrote:
What are the only three words in the English language that start with dw? They are all ordinary words that any native speaker would know.


I count four, but I am not a native speaker. One might be slang, though.

There are in fact, quite a few, if you count multiple words based off of the same stem.

http://www.morewords.com/starts-with/dw/

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #77 Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 4:31 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 38, W: 24
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X m . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . B X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . O O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
from most commonly thought of to least: dwarf, dwindle, dwell (and if you had to use a dictionary or similar tool, you lose)

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #78 Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:47 am 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 38, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X W . . |
$$ | . . O . . . X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . X X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . O O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


It sucks to play here, but it's the only killing move. Besides, I think the game still looks favourable. Depending on the right hand side, Black has no territory, which is still very very valuable in this game. I'm within 20 points and I think I have a lot more than 20 points ahead on the board.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #79 Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 5:21 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 39, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O . . B X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . X X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . O O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]
Uh-oh. This is probably where his stone is, which means I lose.

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 Post subject: Re: Batookovich #1: topazg vs MountainGo
Post #80 Posted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 5:23 pm 
Tengen
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KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Score - B: 38, W: 20
$$ +-----------------------+
$$ | . . . . . p . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . @ . . . . |
$$ | . . m O . . . X W . . |
$$ | . . O . . W X X @ . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | p . . . X X O X X O p |
$$ | . X # X . O O X O . . |
$$ | . O O m X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . m O # . . X m . . |
$$ | . . . O O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ +-----------------------+[/go]


Bump! You got mine too :)

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