What do you suggest?

KenPruitt · Post by **KenPruitt** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:12 am

ruslan05-KenPruitt.sgf: Game I just played.; (3.1 KiB) Downloaded 407 times

This is a game I just played. I was Black. Does anyone see any big mistakes I made? By the way, White escaped.

nacroxnicke · Post by **nacroxnicke** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:26 pm

A important thing about your playstyle, it's that is very center oriented, you should know that a playstyle like that is very risky, because it puts emphasize on fighting, invasions, and such, since the idea behind playing with that is basically growing with a territory so large that the other will need to invade, and then you will start a fight. Playing for such big territories can make the other make big exchanges just to spoil your center, because he has already territory everywhere so you can lose everything if you forget what is important.

That being said, I can make some points about the game, you played good, just keep playing and you will improve

I made some commentaries, but you need to keep in mind that i'm not that strong and some stuff could be potentially wrong, they are suggestions mostly.

skydyr · Post by **skydyr** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:58 pm

I assume by escaped you mean off the board, as opposed to the white group on it? Because that looks dead as a doornail.

KenPruitt · Post by **KenPruitt** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:46 pm

nacroxnicke wrote:A important thing about your playstyle, it's that is very center oriented, you should know that a playstyle like that is very risky, because it puts emphasize on fighting, invasions, and such, since the idea behind playing with that is basically growing with a territory so large that the other will need to invade, and then you will start a fight. Playing for such big territories can make the other make big exchanges just to spoil your center, because he has already territory everywhere so you can lose everything if you forget what is important.

That being said, I can make some points about the game, you played good, just keep playing and you will improve

I made some commentaries, but you need to keep in mind that i'm not that strong and some stuff could be potentially wrong, they are suggestions mostly.

http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=4027

Yeah. I've been told I play like Takemiya... which I think is an insult to Takemiya....

skydyr · Post by **skydyr** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:27 pm

KenPruitt wrote:Yeah. I've been told I play like Takemiya... which I think is an insult to Takemiya....

It might be worth trying to play for a while, say a month or two, in a completely different style... actively try to take territory and ruin your opponents moyo. You may not have a lot of success at first, as it's not what you are used to, but once you get a handle on it, it may give you insights into when your own style is not the right direction to take, or needs to be more restrained.

KenPruitt · Post by **KenPruitt** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:49 pm

skydyr wrote:
KenPruitt wrote:Yeah. I've been told I play like Takemiya... which I think is an insult to Takemiya....

It might be worth trying to play for a while, say a month or two, in a completely different style... actively try to take territory and ruin your opponents moyo. You may not have a lot of success at first, as it's not what you are used to, but once you get a handle on it, it may give you insights into when your own style is not the right direction to take, or needs to be more restrained.

I tried that. One time as White in a 3-Stone Handicap game, I got a Moyo of Doom...

I've played games where I've opened on the 3-4 points (as White), only to end up with major center influence.

Sorry, but the moyo game is the only one I'm capable of playing. Believe me, I've tried playing other styles. It is physically impossible for me.

Kirby · Post by **Kirby** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:06 pm

KenPruitt wrote:It is physically impossible for me.

Well, if you want, you could make a promise to yourself to only play on the 3rd line for, say, the first 50 moves. It might not be a winning strategy, but you can see what it's like to make territory on the sides this way.

KenPruitt · Post by **KenPruitt** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:07 pm

If you don't believe my last post, here's my most recent game as an example.

Bill Spight · Post by **Bill Spight** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:24 pm

A few comments on the first game.

mitsun · Post by **mitsun** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:26 pm

Perfect play through the first 20 moves.

For :b21:

, you should simply continue at D10. When you can stay ahead in a pushing battle like this, there is no reason not to continue. D10 maintains the threat of a strong block at C10, whereas the game move does not have such a strong follow-up. Once W jumps ahead in the pushing battle (previous W move at C10 rather than C11), then your looser jump becomes good.

I suspect most strong players would use :b23:

to pincer, to make maximum use of the strong B wall to the left. But your strategy to emphasize the right side is playable. Through move 32 you have built up a nice moyo on the right, but the W stone at K16 negates much of the usefulness of your wall to the left.

I consider :b33:

to be the first serious mistake in direction. If you want one take-away pointer from the game, this is it. The W group you are approaching is much too large and strong to be attacked, but as a territory move this is small, and it invites W to move into your center area (K15 or J15 or H16). Pushing at K15 would be more consistent with your previous moves, and would make better use of your stones to the left. Another idea would be to leave this local area, say to expand your moyo with a move like N5.

:b57:

is a dan-level move, and the sequence through :b67:

was fantastic. Keep up the moyo strategy!

A few picky points about the life-and-death fight in the rest of the game:

:b71:

-

push W in the wrong direction and help W live inside your moyo. But :b77:

eye-stealing tesuji makes up for this.
:b89:

is not needed. M8 would be an attempt to kill. P10 would be an attempt to continue the attack, intending to let W live and win by territory.

Edit: I see Bill beat me to this, but at least we agree

Bill Spight · Post by **Bill Spight** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:00 pm

A couple of comments on the second game.

Post by **Joaz Banbeck** » Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:32 pm

If you want to play cosmic style, I have a suggestion.

You played this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . 6 4 . . | $$ . . . . . 2 3 . . | $$ . . . . . . 5 . . | $$ . . . . . 1 . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$-------------------|[/go]

Whereas this is joseki too:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . 6 . . . 4 . . | $$ . . . . . 2 3 . . | $$ . . . . . . 5 . . | $$ . . . . . 1 . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$-------------------|[/go]

FWIW, I think that it may require the ladder breaker in the opposite corner - which you had.

It may not be objectively better, but it fits your chosen style.

KenPruitt · Post by **KenPruitt** » Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:53 am

Joaz Banbeck wrote:If you want to play cosmic style, I have a suggestion.

You played this:

$$Wc
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . 6 4 . . |
$$ . . . . . 2 3 . . |
$$ . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$-------------------|

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . 6 4 . . | $$ . . . . . 2 3 . . | $$ . . . . . . 5 . . | $$ . . . . . 1 . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$-------------------|[/go]

Whereas this is joseki too:

$$Wc
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . 6 . . . 4 . . |
$$ . . . . . 2 3 . . |
$$ . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$-------------------|

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . 6 . . . 4 . . | $$ . . . . . 2 3 . . | $$ . . . . . . 5 . . | $$ . . . . . 1 . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$-------------------|[/go]

FWIW, I think that it may require the ladder breaker in the opposite corner - which you had.

It may not be objectively better, but it fits your chosen style.

I don't that that would've worked in my game. I considered it, but to make good use of it, it requires a stone in the parallel corner.

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