Trolling 101

Kirby
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by Kirby »

Well, I was asked to do another speech for Toastmaster's. I don't mind doing it, but this week is kind of busy. I have three AYD games, have a project for work due by the end of the week, and also some bugs to fix at work.

So again, I couldn't give it a lot of prep time. Since I have to memorize the speech, and I wasn't starting until the day before, I thought it would be good to discuss a topic I know about - this time, Go.

I looked at the tips from this thread on my last speech. The most notable advice I took from that was to write the intro and conclusion first. I worked on the middle after that.

Mostly, I tried to compare go to things the audience could relate to, as they are not go players.

Here it is:
The clock is ticking... Tic... Toc... Tic... Toc... You've got to think fast! There are only 10 seconds left... 9... 8... 7...
Should you go for the kill? If it works, you're sure to win. But if not... definite defeat. Maybe trying to kill him is too risky. What about playing it out until the end? Maybe he has a few tricks up his sleeve. Can you afford to play it safe? Tic... Toc... Tic... Toc... It's now or never. You've got to make up your mind. You've got to make your move.
These were the thoughts that rushed through my mind last Sunday, during one of the games I played at the Spring Go Tournament at the Go Center in downtown Seattle.
You're may be asking yourself, "Go? What is that?"
The short answer is, "Go is a board game - kind of like chess". But it's much deeper than that - at over 3000 years old, it's the oldest game in the world with the same original rules. Millions of people play it every day, study it, and many devote their entire lives to it.
The game is not so popular in America - many have never heard of it. But in Asia, thousands of kids, starting from before they can even read, study the game for 10 or more hours a day, in hopes to one day become one of the few... One of the elite... professional players.
Young kids skip high school, or even middle school, so they have a better chance of getting strong at the game.
What is it about this mysterious game? Why have these people sacrificed their lives, all for a board game?
Some say it's the simplicity. Just black and white stones, going on the board - one after another. Tic... Toc... Tic... Toc... Yet from this simple origin, a perfect model to simulate the world is born. Go is an elegant game. Because it has very few rules, there is an astonishing depth of complexity in its strategy. You can learn the game in 5 minutes. But you can improve at it for a lifetime.
Go is like a martial art, but for your mind. You may be familiar with the belt system used in sports like Karate, Judo, Taekwondo, and the like. As you learn the sport, you start by earning colored belts - kyu ranks, if you will. And when you've become a master, you earn your first dan black belt, followed by second dan, and up and up and up. The same system is used in go.
A little known fact is that the dan-ranking system was initially created for go by Dosaku in the 1600s. While a sport like Karate can help you to improve your fighting skills, Go challenges you to improve your mind.
Go is about balance - a skill often needed in life. If you're too aggressive, you'll collapse. If you're too passive, you'll be overcome. If you over-stretch yourself, you'll be too weak. If you under-stretch yourself, you won't have enough points.
Go is about efficiency. As in life, every move that you play matters. If you don't make the best of each turn... Each opportunity... That you're given, you'll lose out. But for me, go is about learning about myself. When I review what I've played, I can see my weaknesses. I can see how to improve. I can see how I can be a better person.
Was I too anxious? Was I impatient? Was I careless? Was I lazy? Go is a fair game - not one of chance. So what I see on the board is objective. It's true. It's me.
I've been playing go for about 10 years. And I've never gotten bored. It's one of my passions. It's something I study. It's something I travel the country for. Sometimes I ask myself why I've kept at it for so long? Why didn't I get bored?
After all, some people say that it's just a game.
Socrates once said, the "Unexamined life is not worth living". It's not just better to examine your life - if you don't, it's *not worth living*.
For me, go is a way to examine my life.
It teaches me about myself - my weaknesses - my bad habits. It's a means of continuous self-improvement. Day after day, month after month, and year after year. Tic... Toc... Tic... Toc... Always aiming to be just a little stronger. Always aiming to improve myself just a little bit more.
A reporter once asked legendary professional player Cho Chikun, "Why go? Why spend such effort on a game, when you could enjoy so many other things in life? Why do you work so hard?"
His reply?
"Yes, that's right. Go is just a game.
Even so, it's go."
I play because it's my go.
Because it's my work.
Because it's the world I've been given."
Come see me around noon tomorrow at the Commons for Asian Heritage Month. I'll be giving a demo of the rules. I hope to see you all there.


One thing I wish I would have improved on would have been to have more repetition - and maybe a more direct point.

Oh, and more preparation would have been nice. Next speech, for sure, I'll spend at least a couple of days on it!
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by Bill Spight »

Very nice speech. Bravo! :D
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Re: Re:

Post by sybob »

Kirby wrote:No, I haven't. Like I said, I suck at communication. That's why my manager recommended it, I think.


Hi Kirby,

Reply to cheer you up.
My first advice to you would be to not accept your manager's advice.
No one, especially your manager, should talk down to you, ever.
Do not accept that, and please do not speak of yourself in terms of "suck at communication".

Anyone can say to anyone that he/she is not good at communication: it is a gratuite statement. Ask him/her to clarify and have him/her make it a constructive point: what communication, when was it not good, which aspects can/should be better, in what situation was it not good, which persons and/or media were involved, etc.

Building selfconfidence, needed for public speaking, comes from within.
Although I applaude your effort to become better (in anything, be it go, be it public speaking, be it debating, be it otherwise), becoming better does not start with practice IMHO.
Don't let anyone plant bad seeds in your heart.

Good luck.
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Re: Re:

Post by DrStraw »

sybob wrote:
Kirby wrote:No, I haven't. Like I said, I suck at communication. That's why my manager recommended it, I think.


Hi Kirby,

Reply to cheer you up.
My first advice to you would be to not accept your manager's advice.
No one, especially your manager, should talk down to you, ever.
Do not accept that, and please do not speak of yourself in terms of "suck at communication".

Anyone can say to anyone that he/she is not good at communication: it is a gratuite statement. Ask him/her to clarify and have him/her make it a constructive point: what communication, when was it not good, which aspects can/should be better, in what situation was it not good, which persons and/or media were involved, etc.

Building selfconfidence, needed for public speaking, comes from within.
Although I applaude your effort to become better (in anything, be it go, be it public speaking, be it debating, be it otherwise), becoming better does not start with practice IMHO.
Don't let anyone plant bad seeds in your heart.

Good luck.


I have to disagree with this. I have been in IT management and have had to tell people that they have problems in certain areas. They need to know. But it must be done in a constructive way to be productive, and it sounds as though Kirby's boss did this - he provided a useful recommendation to remedy it. I got no feeling that his boss was talking down to him.

My neighbor were I live now had a similar problem. He was extremely knowledgeable in his field but had problems with communications. His boss suggested toastmasters. Now my neighbor is a master toastmaster (or whatever the term is) and is an excellent communicator who has recently started his own business. Without that push from his boss I doubt he would have got where he is today.
Still officially AGA 5d but I play so irregularly these days that I am probably only 3d or 4d over the board (but hopefully still 5d in terms of knowledge, theory and the ability to contribute).
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by sybob »

Hello DrStraw,

My earlier reply was directed to Kirby and was intended to cheer him up (as stated). Not to you.

As neither of us were not present when Kirby's manager told him about communication, both your and my view and opinion are irrelevant to Kirby. And never mind possible good intentions on your side, your "feeling" about this is even less relevant and may even be totally off the point.

I also think it is of no use bringing up your personal experience in this matter, as this topic revolves around Kirby and his live. Your personal experience may not be aligned towards his life. I can bring forward my experience (which often indicates a view opposite to yours is best suited), but that is also not relevant to Kirby in this matter. Unless perhaps if Kirby is your neighbor?

It is okay if we perhaps have different views, but let's not bother Kirby with that. That does not help him.

I do hope you do not disagree with me if I try to wish him well when saying "good luck".
So, I say again: good luck to you Kirby.

Regards all.
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by DrStraw »

sybob wrote:Hello DrStraw,

My earlier reply was directed to Kirby and was intended to cheer him up (as stated). Not to you.

As neither of us were not present when Kirby's manager told him about communication, both your and my view and opinion are irrelevant to Kirby. And never mind possible good intentions on your side, your "feeling" about this is even less relevant and may even be totally off the point.

I also think it is of no use bringing up your personal experience in this matter, as this topic revolves around Kirby and his live. Your personal experience may not be aligned towards his life. I can bring forward my experience (which often indicates a view opposite to yours is best suited), but that is also not relevant to Kirby in this matter. Unless perhaps if Kirby is your neighbor?

It is okay if we perhaps have different views, but let's not bother Kirby with that. That does not help him.

I do hope you do not disagree with me if I try to wish him well when saying "good luck".
So, I say again: good luck to you Kirby.

Regards all.


Actually BOTH of us were not present.

Please do not try to tell me not to give Kirby advice when I have experience in this area. I did not tell you to be quiet, merely disagreed with you based on my experience. I am trying to help out a fellow member of this forum by telling him that I think he is lucky to have a boss who cares. You are telling him that you think he has a boss who does not care.

Different opinions. Let Kirby read both and decide for himself.
Still officially AGA 5d but I play so irregularly these days that I am probably only 3d or 4d over the board (but hopefully still 5d in terms of knowledge, theory and the ability to contribute).
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by SpongeBob »

A very nice speech, indeed.

Two small details, that I noticed:
- it is really an interesting fact (that I did not know before) that the dan system was introduced by a Go player. But I would not mention the name Dosaku, because it kind of asumes that the audiance has/should have heard of his name before.
- I would not repeat the TIC TOC at the end of the talk, because here it does not relate to a clock directly and at this point, the only association that I get is that life time is ticking away, and that is not a thought you want to trigger in your audiance ...

Let us know how this is progressing :-)
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by Kirby »

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.

@sybob: I appreciate what your advice about not letting people talk down to you. I think it's good advice. It cheered me up :-)
@DrStraw: Thanks for sharing your personal experience. I think Toastmasters is a good program, which allows people to improve communication if they want to.

Regarding my boss, and the associated discussion... Probably it's best not to discuss this in such detail on a forum :-) My point in starting this thread was not to discuss my work life, but rather to share a few speeches I wrote. I explained a bit about how I got started with this, but I might have shared a bit too much.

@SpongeBob: Thanks for the tips. I pretty much agree, and felt a bit weird, especially about the TIC TOC part. I wanted something to tie different parts of the speech together, and that was the best I could think of. Like you mention, the only real connection that TIC TOC has was to the personal experience of playing during a tournament.
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Re: Trolling 101

Post by SpongeBob »

Kirby wrote:@SpongeBob: Thanks for the tips. I pretty much agree, and felt a bit weird, especially about the TIC TOC part. I wanted something to tie different parts of the speech together, and that was the best I could think of. Like you mention, the only real connection that TIC TOC has was to the personal experience of playing during a tournament.

I liked the ticking at the beginning of the speech - it helps to get the audiences attention and makes it more dynamic.
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