Zen19K 8d -- now with Value Net

[Koosh]

This is a good site to use to keep track of this bot's stats.
90% win rate (across the board) so far...

[Krama]

Could someone place zen18k on goratings list somehow?

It doesn't have to be 100% precise.

[pookpooi]

Could someone place zen18k on goratings list somehow?

It doesn't have to be 100% precise.

I estimated it to be ranked aroud 400th in blitz time setting (that it currently play in kgs, 15sec/move) and 600th in normal time setting (30 minutes main time) and 800th in long time setting (2 hours main time or more).

[yoyoma]

When comparing to goratings.org -- a list of human professional go players -- I feel obligated to put disclaimers: Zen is playing blitz time controls which historically favors the bot. Also we don't know how seriously the humans are taking the games, in particular cloudnotes lost a game where Zen gave him 2 stones, but cloudnotes appeared to be experimenting, or even trying to half give back the handicap by playing 2-2 as the first two moves. Also another problem although goratings is better than Elo and other systems, it still suffers the difficulty of separate player populations. These western pros listed are probably overrated by goratings. There are some crazy rumors about how strong some of the guests playing Zen are. But this is just KGS kibitz so I don't give them much credit for now.

KGS name, real name, goratings rank, goratings rating

HitGirl7, Mark Lee, N/A but should be stronger than those listed below -- Zen won 1-0
cheater, Pavol Lisy, #779, 2800 -- Zen won 3-0
breakfast, Alexander Dinerchtein, #815, 2748 -- Zen won 1-0

For reference Fan Hui is currently #533, 2990.

Also cloudnotes is rumored to be Andy Liu. He is #263, 3152.


For these blitz games it seems clear that it's pro strength. No telling how much that changes if the time controls are longer like the Fan Hui games.

[Krama]

I guess in current blitz settings it is probably on low eastern professional level if not mediocre professional level.

But I guess with the improvement we can assume that in the near future it will reach average professional level even on LTC, which is actually great.

[illluck]

Apparently it is also rumoured to have beaten a "strong" pro (top 10 in China).

[maceta]

look at games with daxiang - it should be chinese 6P

[pookpooi]

Couldn't thought about this in last year

[Krama]

Why is zen not playing on KGS anymore?

[ez4u]

They found out all they needed to know about version 12.4, so until they are ready with 12.5 why play more games?

[pookpooi]

version 12.5 is already playing in computer go server, so maybe on KGS soon?

[ez4u]

version 12.5 is already playing in computer go server, so maybe on KGS soon?

Looking at the 'recent games' list on CGOS, it does not seem that 12.5 can consistently win against 12.4, so maybe it will be a while yet.

[Krama]

Seems like they went backwards with that update.

[johnsmith]

Next to Zen v12.5 name is "1c0g". Maybe that means that Yamato san is using 1 CPU and 0 GPU i.e. not using value network thus causing it to play weaker?

[yoyoma]

Here is the server people are talking about: http://www.yss-aya.com/cgos/19x19/standings.html
Zen 12.5's results: http://www.yss-aya.com/cgos/19x19/cross ... -1c0g.html

12.5 is 17 wins 16 losses to 12.4, so I don't think you can say it's weaker. 12.4 uses the same naming "1c0g", so I guess they are using the same hardware. If you're going by ratings, 12.5 is a little below 12.4 but it's just because 12.5 hasn't played enough games yet. Probably it's rating will get closer to 12.4 after some more games.