what helped you improve?

[djhbrown]

Almost everybody who does anything wants to do it better, for one reason or another. This forum is full of posts from people asking questions and others offering answers, and quite a few threads by people sharing their triumphs. or problems.

And there are lots of posts by people telling other people what do do.

But so far i haven't seen a thread in which people tell their own stories about what they learned themselves, and when, and how.

In my own case, i learned the basics from other people, and stumbled along for a bit, and then took giant 7-league boot strides once i started reading Ishii Press Elementary Series books. It was a long time ago, but i recall that the books by James Davies were the most immediately understandable and helpful to me.

There were one or two others, one about Kage's secrets and Sakata's long and winding road, and a bit later on Kato's Attack and Kill which was a real eye-opener.

Since then, partly from not playing regularly for decades, i haven't improved much, if at all, and it feels like i've gone backwards quite a bit, as people these days often succeed in killing groups i remembered having to be able to make live in the past, but can no longer remember how. Especially when they make moves that look bizarre to me.

Thinking about Swim has started to turn this around a bit, although my improved understanding (what i fondly imagine to be an improved understanding) hasn't produced any performance improvement, partly because i still occasionally miss ataris and am very lazy about reading simple things like ladders, and lazy at reading in general.

So i know that if i really wanted to improve, i would have to work harder at reading - and double-checking that what i think is on the board is actually there. Very often i lose because i was hallucinating that something was connected when it wasn't.

But being a basically lazy person, i can't be fussed, especially when there are so many other new and interesting completely different things to learn about.

Ok, i'm an old goat well past his prime, but many of you are still young, many just starting out, and there are also many of you with just a few years under your belt.

i reckon the ones just starting on Go would like to hear the stories of those with just a few years of experience, those aware that they don't know everything but still have a story to tell.

So please can we hear your story? It doesn't have to be fancy, it doesn't have to be funny, and no-one is going to mark your essay. Just a short story, say a one or two paragraph "Dear Mom, look what i done" type of thing. Everyone has a story to tell - so let's hear yours.

[Kirby]

It's been years since I've had significant improvement, but my biggest improvement came from when I jumped from about KGS 4/5k to KGS 1k/1d.

I attribute it almost completely to the "Train like a pro" series. I did problems seriously for several hours every day after work, during my commute to and from work, and during lunchtime. I don't think I've had that much devotion since then, so maybe that's why I haven't improved much anymore.

That being said, I've been reading a book these days ("You are not so smart"), and people's memories often fill in the gaps, so over time, your memory changes about things. You might think the past was better or worse than it really was.

My memory about improving was back around 2010... Whether or not I'm filling in gaps to remember myself studying more at that time or not... I can't say

[Bonobo]

(Disclaimer: The ranks I talk about are all on OGS, and all based on correspondence games, most if which I play using the analysis feature.)

“Suddenly” I find myself at around 6k.
Why “suddenly”? Well, to me it seems that I was 13-10k just a moment ago. (I’m 60, so … time flies.) Haven’t studied Go in years due to lack of time.

But two things helped me, I think:

• I stopped being obsessed about my rank. Like in: “I don’t give a damn.”
• In the games I lose, I usually resign early, i.e. as soon as I realise that I’ve lost. Sometimes I even resign because I made a big mistake, even before knowing whether my opponent is able to exploit it (in which cases I usually explain why I resigned).

Oh, and maybe a third thing:

• Some time ago I began using the Malkovich log feature on OGS (yeah, they got the idea from here), posting my thoughts and evil board domination plans with variations, etc. Mostly hilarious to read after I realise how much I blundered.

[djhbrown]

I usually resign early, i.e. as soon as I realise that I’ve lost.

I wish to make a complaint! I was hoping we would hear from young players about their experiences, but so far all we've got is three old farts

But i must say, hats off to Bonobo for being a gentleman - it's one thing to live in hope, but quite another to bore the pants off your opp floundering around in desperation like Alfie does On Tilt after it's too late. You have plenty of time after the game to play "what if" games with yourself and go blind in the process.

[Bonobo]

I usually resign early [..]

I wish to make a complaint! I was hoping we would hear from young players about their experiences, but so far all we've got is three old farts

but in our black souls, deep down, there we’re young, aren’t we? But yes, I must confess I didn’t read your post throughly

But i must say, hats off to Bonobo for being a gentleman - it's one thing to live in hope, but quite another to bore the pants off your opp floundering around in desperation [..]

Thanks, the honour’s too much for me, now I owe you one more confession: it’s not really altruistic, it’s less for being polite towards my opponents but rather because I can't stand the pain that I want to put a quick end to my suffering.

[Bill Spight]

What helped me improve?

Well, among other things,

Listening to old farts.

[o00o00o]

I haven't made an insane amount of progress on the goban in terms of ranking up (got some personal things i gotta take care of first, then i can focus on that), but Go has helped me improve as an individual more than anything. I used to flip out and get pissed off every time i lost, but I had to come to the realization that the opponent isn't the problem...I AM. Go isn't about winning, its about improving, and your opponent isn't your competition, YOU ARE. All you and your opponent are doing is pointing out each others flaws and showing one another where you need to improve with your win/loss. Go also shows you a bit of your and your opponents personality as well as a slight insight as to what they are currently dealing with or how they are handling what they are dealing with in sorts, if that makes any sense. Go has a lot of and metaphysical properties to it to, which is why i love the game so much. The principles you derive from it can be applied to day to day life. Outside of that i have a general strategy for improving my game play.

My strategy for improving:

1) Read the recommended books and watch the appropriate videos for my playing level. Take notes and study them until the notes become habitual in gameplay
2) Play games with opponents a few stones stronger than me without handicap. Play a few games with opponents at my level and fewer games with weaker players (you learn new things from the stronger players, you test your skills with same level players, and teach someone who is weaker than you)
3) Review the games/ have someone review my games.
4) Do the problems (tsumego, tesuji, etc.) with consistency
5) Download and study games from stronger players that have already been reviewed and critiqued. Initially i wont understand why this move was critiqued as bad or good, but over time it will begin to make sense as long as i adhere to (1-4), This has given me a bigger advantage because you are learning what things you should and shouldnt do at higher level games.

All in all go is like being your own boss (which has helped me at being my own boss). It will require a ton of blood, sweat, tears, hard work, discipline, and persistence to improve. When it is all said and done it is totally worth it.

[djhbrown]

-everything you said-

a very mature appraisal for one so young - you are young, aren't you?".

One small point: nothing you said applies exclusively to Go; it applies to whatever you do: football, yoga, rocket science, or skipping.

Except for one thing: i don't agree that it has to be blood, sweat and tears - on the contrary, if it feels like that, then it's not the game for you. Just about anything requires a certain innate talent; a certain type of mind. We can all enjoy Debussy's music or Hendrix's poetry, but we can't all compose like them, no matter how hard we try.

When i was young enough that younger people asked my opinion, and were wondering what career path or degree programme to follow, i told them the life philosophy taught to me by Lynn:

if it feels good, do it!

A little Indian brave who before he was ten,
Played war games in the woods with his Indian friends,
And he built a dream that when he grew up,
He would be a fearless warrior Indian Chief

Many moons passed and more the dream grew stronger,
Until tomorrow, he would sing his first war song,
And fight his first battle, but something went wrong,
Surprise attack killed him in his sleep that night

And so castles made of sand,
Melt into the sea, eventually

[Dokuganryu]

I reached KGS 1d in one year, and than stopped playing because I couldn't improve more "instantly", and because of my "rapid" improvement at the beginning I didn't have to deal with to many loses - I was always "underranked", and so had a 65-70% win rate. When my winrate dropped to the normal level, my losing / anger / ego issues came up, and I just quit

How I improved - till around 5k I played 3-5 games per day, than as each game demanded more and more "brain stamina" it dropped to 1-2 games per day. I read Kiseido elementary book series, did 1001 Life and Death problems, 501 Tesuji problems and Making Good Shape, and two tsumego booklets books, the two books by Kato Masao.

This contributed to most of my improvement, I also watched youtube go videos / read some commentaries, and near the end of my playing period joined the Nordic Go Academy which was a great place to improve, but I already lost to my mentality and couldn't earn too much from it...

[djhbrown]

my losing / anger / ego issues

that's a very honest admission, which takes courage to make openly. Many people lose their cool when their performance doesn't meet their hopes. I've done it too.

what do you think of o00o00o's observations?

[Dokuganryu]

When it comes to his strategy how to improve, I agree with everything besides watching stronger players commented games - I believe that it is still better to watch commented pro games / very high dan amateur games than games with more mistakes. If you want to be a wine connoisseur no point in starting from 2$ bottle wine and gradually moving up

About the more psychological observations, also agree, the game shows much about the player (I guess that this is less and less visible as you get stronger, because you being stronger also means that you already tamed your agression/timidity/etc. when it comes to the game). I don't know if go contributed strongly to my "outside of the board" growth, but I think it had some impact.

[John Fairbairn]

- I believe that it is still better to watch commented pro games / very high dan amateur games than games with more mistakes

I think that there may be a trap here, and the internet is making the pit we fall into even deeper.

The key word is "watch." The Japanese pros have ALWAYS advised us to play over (naraberu) games on a board - meaning a real board. The only exception I've seen to that is advice to play over a game in your head straight from a game record.

But for some time now we've had the ability to go click, click, click - a true Mickey Mouse game - which is probably better than nothing but seems to lead detrimentally to progressing too rapidly through the game to allow absorption of the ideas.

Now, with the advent of many videos, watching a strong game is very easy, and it is certainly can be enjoyable (at least when the commentator is Michael Redmond). But too temptingly enjoyable? It seems highly questionable whether as much is absorbed as even with click, click, click even with the psychological advantage of being entertained. The old quip that we never remember what people say to us, we just remember how they made us feel, seems to apply here.

I read an interesting article just a couple, of days ago which said that the latest human memory research suggests we are changing the way we use our memories. Where once we would make some effort to remember facts and ideas, we tend now to decide that we can look information up easily on the internet if needed and so make no effort to absorb it. I know I certainly do that. This is not necessarily a bad thing. The article cited the example of Socrates bemoaning the spread of writing because it would likewise encourage people to stop remembering. But in go it presumably is a bad thing?

[gowan]

- I believe that it is still better to watch commented pro games / very high dan amateur games than games with more mistakes

I think that there may be a trap here, and the internet is making the pit we fall into even deeper.

The key word is "watch." The Japanese pros have ALWAYS advised us to play over (naraberu) games on a board - meaning a real board. The only exception I've seen to that is advice to play over a game in your head straight from a game record.

But for some time now we've had the ability to go click, click, click - a true Mickey Mouse game - which is probably better than nothing but seems to lead detrimentally to progressing too rapidly through the game to allow absorption of the ideas.

Now, with the advent of many videos, watching a strong game is very easy, and it is certainly can be enjoyable (at least when the commentator is Michael Redmond). But too temptingly enjoyable? It seems highly questionable whether as much is absorbed as even with click, click, click even with the psychological advantage of being entertained. The old quip that we never remember what people say to us, we just remember how they made us feel, seems to apply here.

I read an interesting article just a couple, of days ago which said that the latest human memory research suggests we are changing the way we use our memories. Where once we would make some effort to remember facts and ideas, we tend now to decide that we can look information up easily on the internet if needed and so make no effort to absorb it. I know I certainly do that. This is not necessarily a bad thing. The article cited the example of Socrates bemoaning the spread of writing because it would likewise encourage people to stop remembering. But in go it presumably is a bad thing?

Yes, indeed having the internet and other technology available is changing how we use our brains. A mundane example is people relying on GPS to drive from place to place rather than remembering directions or visualizing a map. I have a friend who is a philosophy professor who uses these technological devices and says she feels it is "dumbing her down".

One of the points of playing through the game on a board using stones and using a game record is the benefit from finding the next move in the diagram. It is well known that T Mark Hall, one of the founders of GoGoD, ascribed significant increase in playing strength to transcribing pro games for GoGoD.

[EdLee]

people relying on GPS to drive from place to place rather than remembering directions or visualizing a map.

Off topic:

I don't; stubborn dinosaur here. My 1993 Los Angeles Thomas Guide has been sitting in my car for a quarter century now, and I still use it in L.A. ( I'm happy to google-map and google-street-view at home, but I prefer to use my brain on the road. One drawback and annoying thing is unfamiliar, poorly designed freeway entrances, exits, and intersections, like around US Go Congress 2017 neighborhoods. )

But I also understand why people stopped using a slide rule for logarithms after the pocket calculator; or why most people don't need to learn to ride a horse after the automobile; ( or, in a few years, learn to drive, period. )

I still prefer real stones on a real board to clicking.

[daal]

I haven't made an insane amount of progress on the goban in terms of ranking up (got some personal things i gotta take care of first, then i can focus on that), but Go has helped me improve as an individual more than anything. I used to flip out and get pissed off every time i lost, but I had to come to the realization that the opponent isn't the problem...I AM. Go isn't about winning, its about improving, and your opponent isn't your competition, YOU ARE. All you and your opponent are doing is pointing out each others flaws and showing one another where you need to improve with your win/loss. Go also shows you a bit of your and your opponents personality as well as a slight insight as to what they are currently dealing with or how they are handling what they are dealing with in sorts, if that makes any sense. Go has a lot of and metaphysical properties to it to, which is why i love the game so much. The principles you derive from it can be applied to day to day life. Outside of that i have a general strategy for improving my game play.

This has a down side too. Once you stop improving, the problem is still you. All those reasons you aren't improving is because you have a pile of flaws that you can't overcome. Pretty depressing. When I get pissed off after a game, it's not because of my opponent - it's because I'm disappointed and angry with myself for my own failings.

As far as improvement goes, I got to my current level basically by doing the same things that you describe - playing, reading books, reviewing my games etc. It just seems it didn't get me very far.