To cut or not to cut?

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Gomoto
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To cut or not to cut?

Post by Gomoto »

White to play. To cut or not to cut?

I could not make an informed decision :-)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . O . . . . . . O . . . O . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . O |
$$ | . . O X O . . O . . . . . . . . O O X |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . O . . X X |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . O . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . X . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O O . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . O . X O . . a X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . . X O O O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X O O . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X O . O . . X . . . O O . |
$$ | . X . . X X O O O . . . . . b X O X . |
$$ | X . . . X O X . . . O . . . . O X X . |
$$ | O X X X . . . . X X O . . . . O X . . |
$$ | O O O O X X X X . O . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . O O O O . . . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Last edited by Gomoto on Sun Dec 22, 2019 9:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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rlaalswo
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Re: To cut or not to cut?

Post by rlaalswo »

I'm the kind of player who'd be too scared to cut in an actual game. These days you can always ask to an AI which is always available for you with above any human strength. Leela thinks white must cut to win, and below is a continuation.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . O . . . . . . O . . . O . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . , . . . . . O . . O |
$$ | . . O X O . . O . . . . . . . . O O X |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . O . . X X |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . O . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . X . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O O . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . O . X O . . 1 X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X O . 3 X O O O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X O O . . 4 X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X O . O . . X . . . O O . |
$$ | . X . . X X O O O . . . . 5 2 X O X . |
$$ | X . . . X O X . . . O . . . . O X X . |
$$ | O X X X . . . . X X O . . . . O X . . |
$$ | O O O O X X X X . O . . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . O O O O . . . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Gomoto
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Re: To cut or not to cut?

Post by Gomoto »

I chickened out too, but I think it is a nice reading exercise. The difference is about 9 points according to KataGo.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: To cut or not to cut?

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

Always cut.

And I am saying that without having looked at the diagram.
Help make L19 more organized. Make an index: https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5207
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EricBackus
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Re: To cut or not to cut?

Post by EricBackus »

Joaz Banbeck wrote:Always cut.

And I am saying that without having looked at the diagram.
I learned a "proverb" about this: "Cut first, think later"
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xela
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Re: To cut or not to cut?

Post by xela »

Funny coincidence. On the same day I see a thread here about cutting, and I run into this on neural net go problems:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc19 White to play: are you scared of the cuts at ''a'' or ''b''?
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . a O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . b O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . X X . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . O X . X O . X . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Solution and discussion:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc19
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . O . . . . X . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . b a O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . X X . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . O X . X O . X . . . . . . . O X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
:w1: is the correct answer. Next, the black cut at ''a'' is a terrible move according to LZ-242! White just replies at ''b''. The R15 stones are not cutting stones; sacrificing them to get sente is a good trade for white.
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