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Offline Shaddy
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #101 Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:53 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Captures: B1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X . . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X W |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Ok.. time to bust outta here. I see no way to live in the corner, so I need either an eye on the outside or escape.


Trigger
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X 1 . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X W |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O 2 X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #102 Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:42 pm 
Gosei
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KGS: Chew
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X 1 . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X W |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O 2 X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . 3 . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc diagram 'b'
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X . . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X 3 . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X 2 |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O W . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O 4 1 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X 6 . 7 5 . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So far, this is going along with the earlier diagram I made, reposted here for convenience. Also, Shaddy seems to agree about his needing life on the outside. That is a very large boost to my go-confidence, that I read this much right. One step down, one to go. Oh, and Shaddy: I managed to resist the urge to quote Violence. =D

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Offline Shaddy
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #103 Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:54 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


ARGH. ok, let's make the eye
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #104 Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:47 pm 
Gosei
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I am not necessarily convinced that white gets out or gets the other eye, and if he does, it should be painful. Albeit, I haven't read this very heavily.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc The basic idea
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . 5 . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 2 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 4 1 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc I don't see a great 2 for white.
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . 1 . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #105 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:53 am 
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Chew Terr wrote:
Topazg:
The reason I decided to play here instead is I was concerned that with 'e', I feared that I would capture those four stones while Shaddy made two eyes in the corner, then would have my largest group cut off and surrounded by Shaddy's now-living group.


Golden rule of killing - if you don't think you can, take away the outside and force him to live inside - I suspect instead of capturing those four stones, Shaddy would have to live with his group and give you the opportunity to seal him in, connecting your RHS group to the bottom group with reasonable thickness in the process. That way, one has to ask White "Where are your points?"

That said, this line is far more exciting! *grabs popcorn*
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #106 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 8:14 am 
Gosei
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Move's not ready, but here's some of what I've considered.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Doesn't work, white can capture 3 for an eye
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . 1 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 3 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . 5 . 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . 1 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 6 9 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 7 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 8 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc The best I can see for this path is an impossible ko where white gets to capture first AND has internal ko threats to make a second eye.
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . X . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . 2 5 X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . 3 1 C O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X 4 O X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . X O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O O O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc A liberties race!
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . 5 1 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 9 7 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 8 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 6 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc W is trapped if we play like this. Actually, it's still close, because my bottom group is close in liberties to the corner. However, either I would win, or it could potentially be an awesome seki...
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . 8 . 6 . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . 7 3 X 4 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . X X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . 5 2 X O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X 1 X X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . O O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O O O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Ruh Roh...
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . 7 4 O . 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . 3 X 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . X X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . 9 6 X O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X 5 X X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . O O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O O O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Harleqin
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #107 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 9:54 am 
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Chew Terr wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Doesn't work, white can capture 3 for an eye
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . 1 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 3 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 5 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #108 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:26 am 
Gosei
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . B . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Harleqin wrote:
Chew Terr wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Doesn't work, white can capture 3 for an eye
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . 1 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X W 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 3 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 5 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . 6 . . 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O O O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 7 X . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 5 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Okay, it seems like it may come down to a liberty race that I believe is favorable. I had been reading something flawed (obviously) that looked like white could either make an eye or get out with the main group. As I can't seem to dispute this 5, I should play towards it.

Shaddy: Sorry, I feel bad for taking audience hints. However, that's kind of the purpose of the open format, to improve games from a playing and learning perspective by removing mistakes and clearing up misreads in advance. Also, there'll be plenty of chances for me to mess this up later...

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Offline Shaddy
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #109 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 12:15 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . W X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Time to make like a tree and get outta here.
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #110 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:20 pm 
Gosei
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Posts: 2060
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Debated between N6 and O7. N6 involves my groups living and N5 dying (best case), O7 seems to kill the corner and let the other two small groups live. The corner is bigger, so I'll take that. Below are some options I considered.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . 4 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . W C 2 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 1 3 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . 5 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . 2 X O 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X 1 B 3 5 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 6 . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . 2 X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 1 . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . 8 . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X 7 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . 1 X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 3 5 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 6 4 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 2 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline amnal
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #111 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:30 pm 
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Chew Terr wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . . . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O . O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]




This is a really interesting position. Can white just extend?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X 5 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . 3 X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 2 4 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 6 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This way leaves black's group with problems and white's alive?

It seems like black should have a way to make the vital cut and at least save both groups, but I can't find one. Maybe I'm just being blind :)
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #112 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:46 pm 
Gosei
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anmal:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 2 . O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I'm not certain, but my assumption was that this 3 is the correct response to the extension. My sleepy reading at the moment seems to show that white has to let black cut at P5, or lose more?

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Offline topazg
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #113 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:49 pm 
Tengen
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X 5 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . 6 X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . . 2 4 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O . . O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #114 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:53 pm 
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topazg:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X 8 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 7 2 4 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 5 6 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Not ideal, but I think I get something out of it?

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Offline amnal
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #115 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 3:37 pm 
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Chew Terr wrote:
topazg:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . x O X 8 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O B O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 7 2 4 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 5 6 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Not ideal, but I think I get something out of it?


Yes, this is a line I missed because I didn't read the 5-7 cut. It seems pretty good for white to make the perfect influence position (x is free), but it's better than I had been thinking!
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Offline Shaddy
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #116 Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 3:50 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X 8 X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O X O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . 7 2 4 O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O 5 6 O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O 3 O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This is pretty much what I came up with, so if you'll accept it, I'll take it.
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #117 Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:44 am 
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Shaddy wrote:
This is pretty much what I came up with, so if you'll accept it, I'll take it.


Okay. it's not what I hoped for when I started the fight, but then again, I really assumed that one of us would have a huge amount die, and that it had a good chance to be me. This seems to keep the game playable, so let's play it.

We each have one captured stone, and sente is yours.

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Offline Shaddy
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #118 Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:51 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O X O O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O X O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . . W X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I'll just cancel out the captures. Also... sweet, sweet sente.
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Offline prokofiev
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #119 Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:52 am 
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Should black have pulled out at O9 before playing S10?
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Offline Chew Terr
 Post subject: Re: 66. Shaddy(1d) vs. Chew Terr(5k)
Post #120 Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:56 am 
Gosei
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . O . . . . . O . X . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . O X O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . . . X O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . O O . O . . X O O O O X O O X X . |
$$ | . . X O . X O O X , O X O X O X X X O |
$$ | . . X . . . O X X X X X X X O X O O . |
$$ | . . B O X O . O X . O . X O O O O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X . X . . . X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Prokofiev: Not sure, but I got scared and wanted to defend first, no matter what.

Wellp, we knew this was coming. Hoping that I can come out okay, but I still don't regret sacrificing sente to defend on the eastern side first.

_________________
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].
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