9x9

[Loons]

Man, I've just started playing it ! The game is unbelievably different to 19x19.

If you have disdained it for the "real" game of 19x19 (maybe I was also guilty of this), I really suggest you try it out too.

The gist of it seems to be this;
Playing first is a massive advantage. Though- I haven't come across a supreme first move, I'm liking 3-4 if I'm black (though nothing resembling a 19^2 joseki could possibly happen).

Offsetting this, komi is huge. HUGE - if black plays a boring game, he loses quietly. Ergo, black must make the game interesting.

From there, nothing is simple, with corner magic running into corner magic all over the place. The lack of a middle of the board to escape to really makes the game 1-3 intertwining fights.

Honorable mention: Ko Fights. The threats are very easily calculable (ie relatively few) and huge/local, making ko fights a quite exact - and often game deciding - science.

Here's one of my first experiences;

(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[NZ]SZ[9]KM[0.00]TM[120]OT[3x20 byo-yomi]
PW[moriishita]PB[Loons]WR[3d]BR[3k]DT[2010-08-16]PC[The KGS Go Server at http://www.gokgs.com/]C[moriishita [3d\]: gg
]RE[B+5.00]
;B[gf]BL[114.278]C[Loons [3k\]: gg
]
;W[cd]WL[99.196]
;B[cf]BL[106.088]
;W[df]WL[77.773]
;B[dg]BL[99.293]
;W[de]WL[36.41]
;B[eg]BL[88.196]
;W[gd]WL[33.684]
;B[gc]BL[82.524]
;W[ge]WL[20]OW[3]
;B[fc]BL[41.378]
;W[ff]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fg]BL[1.749]
;W[eb]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ec]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[db]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[dc]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[cc]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ef]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[ee]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fe]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[fd]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ed]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[ff]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[hd]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[he]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[hb]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[id]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ic]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[hc]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[cb]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[bb]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[hd]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[fe]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ie]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[if]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[id]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[gg]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[gh]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[hg]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ce]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[hh]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fi]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[be]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[bf]BL[20]OB[3]
;W[ad]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[hi]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ih]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[bg]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[fb]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[gb]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ii]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[gi]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ga]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fa]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ea]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ha]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[dd]WL[20]OW[2]C[Loons [3k\]: komi so huge in this game eh
]
;B[af]BL[20]OB[2]C[moriishita [3d\]: no komi
Loons [3k\]: Unluckily for you
]
;W[ae]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fa]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ca]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ga]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ei]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[fh]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ch]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[bh]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[dh]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[cg]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[bi]WL[20]OW[2]
;B[ci]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ah]WL[20]OW[1]
;B[ai]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[ib]WL[20]OW[1]
;B[ia]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[bi]WL[20]OW[1]
;B[ac]BL[20]OB[2]
;W[bd]WL[20]OW[1]
;B[ai]BL[20]OB[2]C[Loons [3k\]: oh, shoulda played b6 ...
moriishita [3d\]: :/
Loons [3k\]: But yeah
]
;W[]WL[20]OW[1]
;B[]BL[20]OB[2]TW[aa][ba][da][ab][cb][ac][bc][gf][hf][ig]TB[ib][hc][ag][ah][ch][dh][eh][bi][di][ei]C[Loons [3k\]: Thanks
moriishita [3d\]: ty
Loons [3k\]: This game is so different from 9x9
moriishita [3d\]: ^^
Loons [3k\]: *19x19
moriishita [3d\]: but I can't win without komi
Loons [3k\]: have a good one
Loons [3k\]: yeah
Loons [3k\]: komi is HUGE
moriishita [3d\]: because to have black in 9x9 is a real advantage
])

[GoCat]

Man, I've just started playing it ! The game is unbelievably different to 19x19.

If you have disdained it for the "real" game of 19x19 (maybe I was also guilty of this), I really suggest you try it out too.

I second this... 9x9 is an excellent game and I think it has a valuable place in the process of getting stronger.

The gist of it seems to be this;
Playing first is a massive advantage. Though- I haven't come across a supreme first move....

I always like the center point as the first move, thoyugh i certainly don't know if it's best.

Offsetting this, komi is huge. HUGE...

How big, do you think? I've found that 6.5 komi seems about right, just like in the 19x19 game.

[Loons]

I mean, 6.5 komi is huge because both players are going to have much less territory (There`s only 81 squares on the board compared to 361).

I`ve tried tengen, but I prefer to have my feet on the ground for early fighting.


Edit: Hey, so, the SGF viewer looks pretty ugly with 9x9, eh

[Kirby]

I mean, 6.5 komi is huge because both players are going to have much less territory (There`s only 81 squares on the board compared to 361).

...

That point is true, but it is also possible that there is a very significant advantage to playing first on a small board, as well.

[Suji]

I just have to say that 9x9 is a completely different animal than the full size 19x19 board. It happens also to be more tactical.

[dfan]

My understanding is that tengen is the most popular opening point for pros.

[daniel_the_smith]

My understanding is that tengen is the most popular opening point for pros.

Isn't it fivegen on a 9x9?

[Suji]

My understanding is that tengen is the most popular opening point for pros.

Isn't it fivegen on a 9x9?

This makes sense.

I always thought that tengen meant "center of board", or something really similar to that, though.

[Aphelion]

Yea, 9x9 is insanely hard and deep, all the more so because you so acutely feel the reverberations of each move - there is no local fight anymore, and all the heuristics you knew on big boards go out the window - you have to put in the work and read out all the implications yourself.

Unfortunately I have been intimidated by this realization and avoided playing this for a while. Perhaps a heavy dose of this - together with L&D - would be one of the keys to boost my reading to dan-level?

[Mivo]

I enjoy 9x9 as well, and think it really helps my reading. It's definitely different from 19x19. It's also something to play against the computer, though for us non-dans it's probably too hard to beat some of the better programs that play 9x9 at their full performance.

Is 6.5 the generally accepted komi for 9x9? It seems rather large, but then again, opening on tengen does give a massive advantage.