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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #61 Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 2:39 pm 
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Rank: KGS-AGA-CGA all 2k
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[go]$$Wcm50 Move 50 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . 1 O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Wow I am too happy with this trade :)

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"You always have more ko threats then me" -Dusk Eagle

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #62 Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:40 pm 
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Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
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[go]$$Bcm51 Move 51 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strategy and Thoughts
Okay, so he did the obvious thing and took the stone. Which is good. Means I made the last move basically for free. And it's still staring down into white's moyo.

Still need to make a move to fortify the 3-3 in the top right corner, but since my last move here isn't threatening anything it's gote and if I were white I wouldn't burn sente to make a ko for the top right corner.

There's also still a cut for me in the top at G15. And a pincer at K4 or thereabouts looks pretty big, too. After that I think we might be heading in to the endgame. There really aren't many weak groups on the board. We've both been playing really solidly (maybe even passively?)

I did a quick estimate of the score and I think it's pretty close. Definitely not enough to break my 40 point reverse komi. I'll do a proper count either when I need to decide between an invasion or reduction, or when the endgame starts.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #63 Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:42 am 
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[go]$$Wcm52 Move 52 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X 1 . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Endgame already, sigh

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"You always have more ko threats then me" -Dusk Eagle

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #64 Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:31 pm 
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KGS: Numsgil
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[go]$$Bcm53 Move 53 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strategy and Thoughts
Ah, finally white decides to try something that can lead to fighting.

I don't know all the variations for probes like this. But I'm pretty sure I have to decide between outside influence or inside territory. It isn't usually outright killable. If I force him to live in the corner I don't really get any good compensation, since white has a very stable group along the right edge. So I think I'm much better off taking the corner.

Plus, the hane is usually the correct move against a lone stone attachment. Plus, a hane on the inside forms good shape.


Tactics and Variations
I'm trying to avoid all the diagrams I posted in my last Malkovich, since no one (my future self included) seems to care, but I think this deserves some thought.

Anyway, this seems like the most likely line of play to me. Maybe there's a better way for black to play, though? But I'd be happy enough with this result.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . 3 7 . . |
$$ X . . . X . 2 1 6 . |
$$ , . . . . 5 X O . . |
$$ X . . . . . 4 . 8 . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X X . O . . . |[/go]


Something like this is white playing very aggressively, but I don't think it works very well. Basically white can set up a multi step ko, which if he manages to win means my top moyo is reduced by quite a bit. But that also means I get moves elsewhere on the board and probably make more than adequate compensation.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ X . . . X 5 2 1 . . |
$$ , . . . 7 4 X O . . |
$$ X . . . 8 9 6 . . . |
$$ . . . . . 0 . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X X . O . . . |[/go]


White could also try playing lightly, just leaving the stone as a forcing move or placing a few stones around the area, but since he has a strong position on the right edge I think he's better off pushing his advantage here and making territory.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #65 Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:53 am 
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[go]$$Wcm54 Move 54 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


My planned sequence:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X W 4 . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . 1 2 5 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . 8 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm10
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . 1 X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This way I protect my cut on the top and solidify some territory on the right with options of pushing into his upper right moyo. I fear if I do things more normally I might get more territory on the side, but the cut at the top would be his 20ish points to take. I feel taking a less on the side is worth keeping the 2 stones on the top.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #66 Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:06 am 
Lives in gote

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Kerby wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm54 Move 54 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


My planned sequence:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X W 4 . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . 1 2 5 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . . . 8 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm10
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . 1 X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This way I protect my cut on the top and solidify some territory on the right with options of pushing into his upper right moyo. I fear if I do things more normally I might get more territory on the side, but the cut at the top would be his 20ish points to take. I feel taking a less on the side is worth keeping the 2 stones on the top.


This seems an unnecessarily helpful and complex way of making a small jump from white's stones on the right.


[/hide]

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #67 Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:04 pm 
Lives in gote
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Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm55 Move 55 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . 1 X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strategy and Thoughts
Yeah, this is the sort of thing where I tend to make tactical errors and over extend myself. I'm consciously playing the safest move I can see that still gives me a strong bit of territory.


Tactics and Variations
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ -----------------
$$ . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . X . b X c . |
$$ . . . a X O d . |
$$ . . . . O e . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . |[/go]


'a' is a contact move that strengthens the weakest stone in the area. Very bread and butter.
'b' is a contact move that forms a large stable group. It invites white to secure himself at 'e'. I don't like it because it looks overconcentrated with the existing stone at O17.
'c' wants to grab the corner. But then white can either hane at 'a' or 'b' and cause some complicated fighting, which I would probably be at a disadvantage in.
'd' tries to grab an even larger corner. But that's just silly since it forces white to strengthen himself. So really it's a "thankyou" move.
'e' is very aggressive, and starts a complex battle. Again, I feel like I would be at a disadvantage on the board in a fight like this, just based on counting liberties of each player's groups. White extends downwards and I have two groups with only two liberties, while white has one group with two and one group with three. Plus white is probably the stronger tactical fighter, so don't tempt fate, yeah?

Taking these 5 moves as my base instinct (no other moves percolate to the top of my conscious thought), we can knock away some of them using heuristics. From contact fight rules, the stone at Q16 is the weakest (fewest liberties), so needs the most urgent defense. So that knocks out 'c' and 'd'.

So the only real choice is between 'a', 'e', and 'b'. 'b' feels too solid and over concentrated, as I already mentioned. 'e' feels too loose, just asking for trouble and complications. So the nice goldilocks move is 'a'.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #68 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:41 am 
Gosei

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I don't know if this is fair, but the thing I don't like about this move is that if you were Black and had two free moves to play in this position:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . X . . . b . . X . . |
$$ . , . . . . a X O . . |
$$ . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

would you put them at a and b? I feel like each of those stones makes the other one kind of redundant.

I haven't done any reading but my instinct would be to crosscut or make the solid connection at Q17.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #69 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:19 am 
Tengen
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dfan wrote:
I don't know if this is fair, but the thing I don't like about this move is that if you were Black and had two free moves to play in this position:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . X . . . b . . X . . |
$$ . , . . . . a X O . . |
$$ . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

would you put them at a and b? I feel like each of those stones makes the other one kind of redundant.

I haven't done any reading but my instinct would be to crosscut or make the solid connection at Q17.

my personal opinion on black's move : it is a solid move. is it an example of overconcentration? maybe but i can see the merit and it should be labeled as a solid move.
edit: i am not saying that is is an optimal move. probably not..
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ . , . . . . B X O . . |
$$ . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

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The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson


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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #70 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:29 am 
Dies with sente
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm56 Move 56 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Well, almost as planned

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #71 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:29 pm 
Lives in gote
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KGS: Numsgil
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm57 Move 57 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strategy and Thoughts
White's treating those stones lightly, and trying to protect the cut at G15 and enlarge his moyo. But it's gote, and it doesn't do a great job of either. And other than the sorta shapeless stones in the center, I don't have any real weaknesses for white to exploit. I have free reign to move wherever I like, really.


Counting and Scoring
Alright, let's see where the score stands. For simplicity's sake, let's treat moyos as solid territory.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm56 Move 56 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . b . . . b . . . . . . b . . |
$$ | . . . . X b . . . b . . . . . . b . . |
$$ | b X b . . b . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O w . b . . b b X X O w w |
$$ | w w O O O O . w . X b b . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . w O . . . . . . w . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . w . . . . . . . . w . . . |
$$ | . . . . . w . . . . . . . . . w . . . |
$$ | . . . . w . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . w . . d a m e . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . w . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O w . . . . . . . . X . w . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . w . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . w . O w w w |
$$ | b X O , X . . O w w w w w O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . b . . w . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . b . . w . . . . . O X . X b b |
$$ | . . . . b . . w . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Black:

Lower right corner: 5
Lower left corner: 15
Top right: 25
Top left: 10

Total: 55

White:
Bottom: 15
Right: 40
Left side: 30

Total: 85

So if white gets everything he wants right now, he's winning on the board, and even with reverse komi it'd be a close game. Unacceptable.

But! I have sente. So give me 15 points, as a round number benefit of sente. Now it's 70 to 85. Still white's winning on the board. Which means white is asking for too much. White is not solid territory yet at all. Which usually means an invasion is called for. I'm terrible at proper invasions deep inside a moyo, but attacking invasions with nearby stones for backup seems manageable.


Tactics and Variations
Reductions keep sente. Invasions lose sente. White has three moyos.

Let's examine weak spots for reductions and/or invasions:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . c . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . b b . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . b b . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


'a' attacks white's light stones with an attacking invasion/reduction (it's right on the line between the two, and it's a shallow moyo, so hard to say which it is). So it not only reduces the moyo, but threatens to swallow up white's stones here in a big way. If I do kill those white stones, I should expect to do so in gote.

Any of the 'b's are also attacking invasions. They seek to isolate the lone white stone, which will limit the bottom moyo. The danger is that white might be able to enlarge the left side moyo if I'm not careful. If I'm careful, I run the weak group all through white's moyo and make crazy profit.

'c' is a light reduction right on the moyo boundary. I would expect to keep sente with such a move. If white ignores, I start diving even deeper into his moyo and suddenly white's moyo has become very flat, with his east-west wall very over-concentrated.

...

Given the three moves, I chose 'a' because it also doubles as an attack on a weak group that I can maybe even kill outright. 'c' might not be as sente as I'd like, and I'm concerned that if white ignores it to take another big point I don't have a compelling sente followup. Two big black gote moves in a row seem manageable for white.

'b's are tempting, but it's hard to see where the profit from the attack would come from. It is running a weak group in to a moyo, though, so in the hands of a skilled player, no doubt it would be a devastating attack. But 'a' seems more straightforward as far as profit and ways in which white might follow up.

Which ways am I expecting white to respond? He's going to be might tempted to peek through the elephant's eye weakness, but that doesn't end well I don't think:

eg:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X . . X . . |
$$ . . e d X X O . . |
$$ . . c b 0 O a . . |
$$ . . 5 7 8 9 . . . |
$$ . . . 6 3 1 . . . |
$$ . . . 4 2 . . . . |
$$ . . X X . O . . . |
$$ . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . |[/go]


More Tactics and Variations
The cut at G15 might still work, or it might not. I've tried reading it out a few ways. It's definitely not obvious to me. But even if it does work, it mostly just forces white to build up a solid wall for his moyo in sente with minimal losses. So it's not a great move to make regardless. It is some aji, though, that I can try and exploit later. Something to keep in mind.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #72 Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 12:20 pm 
Dies with sente
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Hey Nums, There is no way I'll be ahead on the board by 40 pts. If you want to keep playing I'd love to finish the game.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm58 Move 58 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . 8 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . 6 4 7 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 1 5 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 2 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


or

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . 4 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , 5 . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I get a sente reduction in the bottom right corner:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , 1 3 . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X 2 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


or

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . 5 . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , 1 4 . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X 3 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 6 . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I feel I will be ahead on the board in the end, but definitely not by 40pts more like 10-15.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #73 Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:09 pm 
Lives in gote
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I'll move a bit later tonight.

In the mean time:
Strategy and Thoughts

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #74 Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 9:03 pm 
Lives in gote
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Posts: 614
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Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm59 Move 59 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Hey Kerby:

Quote:
Hey Nums, There is no way I'll be ahead on the board by 40 pts. If you want to keep playing I'd love to finish the game.


Yeah, by all means lets keep going. I'm not sure how you want to handle komi, but whatever you think is fair. Well, not too fair :)

Strategy and Thoughts
Kerby's no doubt frustrated that I wasn't making mistakes, but this is exactly the time where I would expect myself to make a mistake. Everything up to here is exactly the sort of go I'm good at. Contact fights are where things turn grim.

The hope here is to outright kill off the isolated two white stones and capture the entire corner in the process.


Tactics and Variations
There are a half dozen moves that look playable to me here, but I can limit it to two using two fundamental rules:

1. Respond to contact moves with a contact move
2. The hane is preferable to the extension if your opponent doesn't have more liberties and/or if you can get away with it.

So:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -----------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X . . X . . |
$$ . . . . X X O . . |
$$ . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . . a . . |
$$ . . . . . X O . . |
$$ . . . . . . b . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . X X . O . . . |
$$ . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . |[/go]


One reading of 'a':
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -----------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X . . X . . |
$$ . . . . X X O 4 . |
$$ . . . . 7 O 3 8 . |
$$ . . . . 5 2 1 6 . |
$$ . . . . . X O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . X X . O . . . |
$$ . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . |[/go]


I don't think white's going to play like that, but other moves for white seem worse off. We'll see what he comes up with. I also need to read out if I can descend with 3 instead of cutting.

'b' seems weird. Why play 'b' if I almost have to play 'a' right after? Seems like a very kyu-ish line of play.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -----------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X . . X . . |
$$ . . . . X X O . . |
$$ . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . 5 3 . . |
$$ . . . . . X O 4 . |
$$ . . . . . 2 1 . . |
$$ . . X X . O . 6 . |
$$ . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . |[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #75 Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 11:18 am 
Dies with sente
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[go]$$Wcm60 Move 60 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Hey Nums, Its your win, but it would be nice to play it out to the end and see what the score on the board ends up being.

Next on the agenda, the bottom right. Then I have to figure out what is worth most out of a few different options.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . e . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O c . . . . . 2 X f . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . d , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . 7 . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . b . . . O O , 3 6 . |
$$ | . . X . . a . . . . . . O . O X 5 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . 8 . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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"You always have more ko threats then me" -Dusk Eagle

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #76 Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 1:44 pm 
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Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
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[go]$$Bcm61 Move 61 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . 1 X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Alright, I'll play as if it's an even game (ie: I won't turtle up trying to coast to a victory from reverse komi), and we'll see where the score ends up.

Strategy and Thoughts
Hmm, this is more passive for white than I thought he'd go. Doesn't really seem to exploit the aji of his light stones at all. I have the feeling that Kerby and I have similar play styles that try to avoid complicated fighting. Or any fighting really. We both shore up strong positions, waiting for the opponent to make a mistake and jump into it with lots of support.


Tactics and Variations
Only two moves worth considering. The move I made is gote and basically ends the sequence. This was the other line of play to think about. There's enough aji in the position that I definitely prefer the solid connection, and physically grabbing corner territory more or less solidly.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ----------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . 1 4 X 6 . |
$$ . . . . . 5 X O . . |
$$ . . . . . 2 3 O . . |
$$ . . . X X 7 O . . . |
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #77 Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:59 pm 
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Sounds like a good plan.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm62 Move 62 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , 1 . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


As per plan, still deciding where I want to play after this corner.

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #78 Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 12:26 pm 
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Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
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[go]$$Bcm63 Move 63 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strategy and Thoughts
This is a huge end game move. I thought it was gote for both sides, though, so I wasn't thinking about it until after all the attackable groups were attacked. But I'm not sure if I can live if white gets another move in the area. I'm not sure I would die either, necessarily. I give it 70/30 to dying, though, so it's not worth the risk, and suddenly the end game move is a sente mid game move for white.


Tactics and Variations
Erg, this was a huge move for me:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 2 . . |
$$ . . . . . . O 1 . . |
$$ , . . . O O , 3 . . |
$$ . . . O . O X . . . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


...

Okay, some reading:

This way is a ko I believe. White takes first.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 3 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 1 2 5 |
$$ . . . . O X . X . 6 |
$$ . . . . . . X . 4 . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


Black lives this way, I believe.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ , . . . O O , O . . |
$$ . . . O . O X 5 2 6 |
$$ . . . . O X . X 1 3 |
$$ . . . . . . X . 4 . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


Black is dead, I think.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . 5 . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 4 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 1 2 . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . 3 . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


If I make a move in the area first, I can live, because I can force my ponnukki into an eye.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 4 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 1 2 . |
$$ . . . . O X . X 3 . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


If I try to be more aggressive with my defense, let's see what sort of damage white can wreak.

I'm fine this way:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . 4 . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 1 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 2 3 . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . 5 . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


If I play it safe this way, I can end in sente if white plays automatically and captures the stone with 6 (since it doesn't threaten to kill or make life, it's just an endgame move). But if I assume that he's at least as good as I am, this'll end in gote and I won't gain anything over a more straightforward line of play, and I'll introduce uncertainty depending on what white can read out that I can't.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . 4 . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 1 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 3 2 6 |
$$ . . . . O X . X 5 . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


I could trade the corner to live on the side maybe. But I'm not sure I could do it (I'd say 60/40 in favor of living on the side) and I'm not sure it would be worth more points. (Losing the corner is maybe 20 points).
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . 3 . |
$$ , . . . O O , O 1 . |
$$ . . . O . O X 4 2 . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ------------------[/go]


...

So final conclusion: this is probably the best sequence as far as profit vs. risk. Just simply defend the eye. White will almost certainly take sente and defend the bottom moyo I've been eying an attack on.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ , . . . O O , O . . |
$$ . . . O . O X 1 . . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #79 Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 10:39 am 
Dies with sente
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Location: Canada
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Rank: KGS-AGA-CGA all 2k
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm64 Move 64 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . 1 . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If I descend here:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . , . . . O O , O 2 . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X a . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Then I only threaten to kill his group with ko starting at "a" if he ignores(which he very well may). The problem is the point of the game we are at. Even if I can win this ko, I would have to give Nums 2 moves in a row. I don't feel at this point in the game the ko is worth 2 potentially large moves. Its not an easy ko to win as he has 1 additional internal ko threat.

I have decided to cover my last weak group. If he gets a chance to attack it it would be very painful for me after this I can start to reduce nums as much as possible.

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"You always have more ko threats then me" -Dusk Eagle

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 Post subject: Re: 63. Kerby (2k) vs. Numsgil (6k)
Post #80 Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 1:14 pm 
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Liked others: 28
Was liked: 65
Rank: 1 Kyu KGS
KGS: Numsgil
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm65 Move 65 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O 1 . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Scoring and Counting
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . b . . . b . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X b . . . b . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | b X b . . b . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . b . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | w w O O O O w . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . w O . b . . . . X X b b |
$$ | . . . . . . w . . . . b . . . X O w w |
$$ | . . . . . w . . . . . . b . b . O . . |
$$ | . . . . w . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . w . . . d a m e . X w . . . . . |
$$ | . . . w . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . w . . . . . . . X . w . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . w . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . w . O . . . |
$$ | b X O , X . . O w O w w w O O , O w w |
$$ | . . X . b . . w . . . . O . O X X b b |
$$ | . . . . b . . w . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . b . . w . . . . . w . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Same trick. Let's count moyo's like they're solid territory to see if white is asking for too much (still rounding to multiples of 5).

Black:

Top Right: ~50 points
Top Left: ~10 points
Bottom Left: ~15 points
Bottom Right: ~5 points (actually it's like 7, which is weird to round to 5 but let's err conservatively I guess).

White:
Left: ~35 points
Bottom: ~15 points
Right: ~35 points

So the score is currently something like: Black 80 White 85. We can add a 5 point komi to white if we really want to treat this as an even game.

Which puts my 10 points behind or so, but I have sente. More reasonable than last time, certainly. Right on the fence between "I'm behind" and "it's an even game", especially with my score counting being so loose. So I'm not really sure if I need to invade, or if I can reasonably get away with reductions and strong defense of my moyo on top.


Strategy and Thoughts
Defending the bottom moyo is what I would have done, so good for him. I think playing high is a potential mistake as it leaves behind some significant aji.

Based on the score, I'm really on the fence about invading or not. I'm not good at invading (in that I can't read out what's going to happen before it happens since it involves peculiar play by either side for the first half dozen moves or so), so if I can win without playing an invasion inside a white moyo I'll be happy.

Anyway, these are the big points on the board. I'll examine each a bit more in depth in different tactics sections below:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm64 Move 64 Captures: W: 2 B: 1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O c . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . d . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . e . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . a . . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


'a' is an end game tesuji. When it's on teh second line it's big. When it's on the third line it's less common, but huge. The hard part is that if white blocks on the outside I have to be able to exploit enough aji to live with it.

'b' is a weak point (maybe?) of this white formation. There's so much aji with my stone at Q8, and white is so high (almost all stones on the 4th line or above), that living inside is a distinct possibility. I'd say 40% chance that I could live inside. And I think 'b' is how to start that sequence. The question becomes: if I fail, does white gain an appalling amount of thickness he can use to counterattack? I'm pretty strong on all sides, so I don't think so.

'c' These two stones are in contact, and they both really urgently want to walk. Whoever walks first changes the score in this area by a significant amount, since these are boundary stones between two moyos. Actually now that I'm building a moyo on the top, this is a really urgent move.

'd' A basic reduction against the white moyo.

'e' A reduction from the other side. Not terribly interesting, though, so I'm not going to explore it.


Tactics and Variations 'a'
This is what I want to be able to get away with
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . 3 1 2 . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If white blocks on the other side, I don't think it works out well for him. This is the sort of thing that branches very quickly, and the reading is very difficult. But I think it's a reasonable risk/reward ratio.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . 8 6 . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O . X . 7 O 5 O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . b 0 2 1 3 4 . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . c d a 9 f g . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . e . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Tactics and Variations 'b'
Maybe something like this?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ -------------------
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . 6 4 . |
$$ . . . . O O X . 5 . |
$$ . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . 1 3 . |
$$ . . . . . . O 7 2 . |
$$ O . . . O O 9 O 8 . |
$$ . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ -------------------[/go]


Tactics and Variations 'c'
I think I can get away with this in sente. It's big, too.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O 1 . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |[/go]


White does not want to ignore.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 4 O 1 . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 3 . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |[/go]


White wants this point, too. It enlarges the wall on this side by quite a bit.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X 2 . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O 1 . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |[/go]


Tactics and Variations 'd'
Just outside the moyo boundary. Also near the middle of the line, which is the weakest part. Even after white defends I'm not in danger so I get to make this move in sente.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ {LN J14 D10}
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Tactics and Variations Conclusion
So this is the actual sequence I'm shooting for. Get all the sente sequences I can, starting with the one that feels urgent, then take the huge end game point in gote.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ {LN J13 D10}
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . . . . O . X . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . , . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . . X . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O 1 . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . 6 4 . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . 5 3 . . . . . X X . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . X O O , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X . . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X O , X . . O . O . . . O O , O . . |
$$ | . . X . . . 9 7 8 . . . O . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

_________________
1k KGS

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