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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #201 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:10 pm 
Gosei
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KGS: Chew
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 4, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . 2 O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O . X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . . . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . 7 a X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . 5 O 6 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . 3 2 O 4 8 O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . z . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Too bad this doesn't work because white gets 'a' in sente. It's close, though. Of course, before this, black would have to start with his aforementioned peep at z.

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #202 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:16 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O 3 X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . 5 . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O . . O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
seriously ...i lost my will to comment for i am losing by too much. i think i will resign soon. he is ahead by more than 20 points. probably 30.

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Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #203 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:18 pm 
Honinbo

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KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . . O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O 6 . O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Hopefully sente...

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #204 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:20 pm 
Honinbo

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Maybe I made a bit of a mistake because of the P10 peep... Maybe not. I'll see how he answers, first.

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #205 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:22 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . 7 O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #206 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:24 pm 
Honinbo

Posts: 9552
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KGS: Kirby
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . O O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . 8 O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #207 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:25 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . O O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X 9 O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #208 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:26 pm 
Honinbo

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KGS: Kirby
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm141 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . O O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X O O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X 0 . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #209 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:28 pm 
Honinbo

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R9 might have been better for my last move, but I'm not sure. I'm happy enough with sente.

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #210 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:28 pm 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm151 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . O O X O X . . X X O . O O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X O O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X 1 . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #211 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:30 pm 
Honinbo

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm151 Has Captured: B - 5, W - 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . . X O . X O O . . O O X O X . X . |
$$ | . X . X . X X X O , . . . O O X X O . |
$$ | X . X X . . . O X O . O . O X . O . . |
$$ | X . . X O . . . X O . . X X X . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . X . X O . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | 2 O O X O X . . X X O . O O . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . O X O O . O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O O X X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O X . X . X O . . |
$$ | . O O O . . . X O O X X . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X . X O O O X O . . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . X . X . . X O O . O O . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O O O X X X . O X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O . X . X O . X . . . |
$$ | . . X . . O . X X . X X . O . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #212 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:35 pm 
Tengen
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KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
no point in continuing.
i resign.

congratulation!

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #213 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:36 pm 
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Thanks for playing, Magicwand. Now, I know you are not invincible. Would you like to play again at 4 stones?

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #214 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:39 pm 
Tengen
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Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
set it up! i will start after i go home

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #215 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:40 pm 
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Thank you very much, sir.

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #216 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:13 pm 
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Magicwand wrote:
...i will try to explain to best of my ability.
every move he played is a dan level move.
but there are some difference between his global reading and my global reading.

for example his H3 pincer. this move look good because he is attacking my lonely stone and avoid me attacking him.
but i wouldn't play this move if i was kirby. i would have played @ D6. to tell you the truth i can not be 100% sure if my choice is better but i will give you my reason so you can think about the difference.
because he played the pincer first i get to block the left side in sente and stablized my white group.
in my opinion he missed the flow of the game. it is better for him to let me attack his stone than the actual game of getting blocked and letting me stablize the group in sente. i guess because i played many many many taugh handycap games i can feel the differnece. it is suttle but i think it will make a world of difference at the end.

i hope this answered your question. if you have more question feel free to ask anytime ;)...



This comment makes me feel that something like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Diagram A
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


is better for black than something like this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Diagram B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . X . . X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]




Am I getting this correct? I'm not sure that I understand the concept of the "flow of the game".

Could you elaborate more on why Diagram A is better than Diagram B?

How can I understand the "flow of the game"?

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #217 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:17 pm 
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Well, for one, Diagram A is Black's move...

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #218 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 8:03 pm 
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I'm too weak to have much of a meaningful opinion here, but I can give you my feeling watching the two moves. Diagram A feels like Black is trying to win the game. Diagram B feels like Black is trying to not lose and just avoid mistakes.

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #219 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 8:44 pm 
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I must say that I like the second diagram alot better than the first. It looks to me like more active playing than the first, and there is an effort being made to attack white. Is this wrong?

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 Post subject: Re: Magicwand vs. Kirby: Comeback Match!
Post #220 Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:36 pm 
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The second diagram makes me feel that Black is trying to deny White everything, and the end result is like trying to hold water with paper - when White does come out you get enclosed and it becomes an exercise in just holding on to all your groups - which probably won't work if 5 stones is the right handicap.

In the second diagram its very controlled, Black made sure that White can only get something in the bottom, and freely gives the attack to white - with the caveat that trying to kill is quite difficult indeed.

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