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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #1 Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 6:37 pm 
Tengen
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BLACK TO CAPTURE
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X . O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O . . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . . . . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline Cassandra
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #2 Posted: Fri Sep 24, 2010 6:50 am 
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Magicwand wrote:
BLACK TO CAPTURE

The main path isn't so difficult, is it ?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . 3 . . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

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The really most difficult Go problem ever: https://igohatsuyoron120.de/index.htm
Igo Hatsuyōron #120 (really solved by KataGo)
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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #3 Posted: Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:03 am 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
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Cassandra wrote:
Magicwand wrote:
BLACK TO CAPTURE

The main path isn't so difficult, is it ?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O . X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . 3 . . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]


if 4 then what??? this problem gave me some hard time. there are not toomany variations but some moves are hard to see.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . 3 . . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

_________________
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline Cassandra
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #4 Posted: Fri Sep 24, 2010 8:02 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O 7 . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O 6 3 5 . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

There are problems, which are easier for weaker than for stronger players.

One example is this "snowman" by Chô U (hidden, because this might be slightly off-topic here).
From his 2006 book "Chô U no Tsume Go"
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ | . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . X X X X . . .
$$ | . . X . O O X . . .
$$ | . . X O . . O X . .
$$ | . . X O . . O X X .
$$ | . X O . . . . O X .
$$ | . X O . . . . O X .
$$ | . X . O . . O X X .
$$ ----------------------[/go]

This problem is rated 4.5 stars out of 5, but there had been some low level SDK's coming up with a very elegant solution, not to be found in the book.

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The really most difficult Go problem ever: https://igohatsuyoron120.de/index.htm
Igo Hatsuyōron #120 (really solved by KataGo)
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Offline DIV
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #5 Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 3:24 am 
Dies with sente
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Rank: KGS 12k
KGS: DIVINATION
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O 7 . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O 6 3 5 . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

is this right? I have worked it through and can't seem to find it being correct. 8 at j1.


can someone post the correct answer or message me with it?
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Offline cyclops
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #6 Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 4:29 am 
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@DIV:
9B@e3(atari),10W@f2,11B@h1 ( falsifies the eye there)

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #7 Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 2:48 am 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
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KGS: magicwand
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Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
DIV wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O 7 . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O 6 3 5 . . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

is this right? I have worked it through and can't seem to find it being correct. 8 at j1.


can someone post the correct answer or message me with it?


i posted the question so i will give you correct answer.
white dies.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X 9 O 7 . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O 6 3 5 8 . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O X . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X X O X . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O 1 O O X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . 2 O . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]



text book answer will be as below
[hide]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 8 O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X 9 O 7 0 O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . 3 5 6 . . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]

_________________
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline ndkrempel
 Post subject: Re: L & D Series from cyberoro (5D PLUS) problem #180
Post #8 Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 8:26 pm 
Beginner

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Rank: BGA 3 dan
KGS: ndkrempel
To follow up on the above, it would be wrong to capture white 6. It would lead to ko, as in the following main line:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X 2 O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O 1 . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X . O . . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O 4 X X X . . |
$$ | . . . X O . 3 5 6 7 . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]



Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm8
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O X . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X 4 O 2 . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O O X X X 5 . |
$$ | . . . X O 1 X X 3 X . . . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm13
$$ -----------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . X X X . X . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O O . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , X O X . O O O X . |
$$ | . . . X X O X . O X O X . |
$$ | . . . X O . O O X X X O 3 |
$$ | . . . X O O 4 1 O X . 2 . |
$$ ----------------------------[/go]


After black's mistake at 7, the above sequence is unique (except 10 and 12 can be played in the other order.) Verifying this is left as an exercise to the reader...
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