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Offline entropi
 Post subject: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #1 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:32 am 
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Hi,
The white group seems to form a basic corner shape but I couldn't find it on senseis. What is its status?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . . . , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]



Thanks in advance

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Offline hyperpape
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #2 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:42 am 
Tengen

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Is the title just a way to get attention (and if so, that's cute), or did you misclick because of the phone?

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Offline entropi
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #3 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:46 am 
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hyperpape wrote:
Is the title just a way to get attention (and if so, that's cute), or did you misclick because of the phone?


Haha, no I didn't misclick :) I was playing fast on 9x9 board and igowin on iphone shamelessly killed my group. Looking at the shape later I couldn't figure out the true status of my group.

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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #4 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:53 am 
Honinbo

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How would you try to kill as Black?

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— Winona Adkins

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Offline entropi
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #5 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:58 am 
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Bill Spight wrote:
How would you try to kill as Black?


First instinct, hane.

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Offline unkx80
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #6 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 9:32 am 
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Some thoughts. Not a solution.

This problem looks hideously similar to a problem I have seen before. So my first instinct is as follows.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . .
$$| . X X X . . .
$$| 5 O O X . . .
$$| . 3 4 , X X .
$$| . . O . . . .
$$| . O . . X . .
$$| . 2 1 . . . .
$$---------------[/go]


Then I saw the following.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . .
$$| . X X X . . .
$$| . O O X . . .
$$| . 2 . 0 X X .
$$| . . O 8 6 7 .
$$| . O . 4 X 9 .
$$| . 3 1 5 . . .
$$---------------[/go]


I am too brain dead now to think of much more.

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Offline Toge
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #7 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:14 am 
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Solve these in my head? No way.

This was my initial thought:
a and b are miai, c and d are miai.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 2 . c , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| 1 d O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| b O . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . a 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]


But it leads to seki:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 0 O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 2 . 6 , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| 1 7 O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 5 O 8 9 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]


Then I noticed atari above "c" in the first diagram kills it, so white 2 must be wrong. In any case, black 1's connection should be severed. This was my thought, but white move 2 at W10 proved to be formidable.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 2 O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 9 . 6 , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| 1 7 O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 5 O 8 0 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . 4 3 a . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]


Edit: Corrected SGF. First move at b4.



Last edited by Toge on Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:38 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #8 Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:16 am 
Honinbo

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Also not a solution. ;)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$ Life
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 9 O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 0 7 8 , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| 2 . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O 5 1 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 6 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$ Ko
$$| . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . 8 7 , X X . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$| 2 . O 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| . O 5 1 X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$| 6 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$-----------------------------------------[/go]


Edit: Added a variation.

_________________
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins

Visualize whirled peas.

Everything with love. Stay safe.
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Offline ez4u
 Post subject: Re: shameless iphone killed my group
Post #9 Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:45 am 
Oza
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A solution?

Sometimes the blunt play is the way to go.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . .
$$| . X X X . . .
$$| . O O X . . .
$$| . 1 2 , X X .
$$| . . O . . . .
$$| . O . . X . .
$$| . . 3 . . . .
$$---------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . .
$$| . X X X . . .
$$| . O O X . . .
$$| . 1 5 , X X .
$$| 7 6 O . . . .
$$| . O . 2 X . .
$$| . . 3 4 . . .
$$---------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$| . . X . . . .
$$| . X X X . . .
$$| . O O X . . .
$$| . 1 . , X X .
$$| . . O . . . .
$$| . O . 3 X . .
$$| . . 2 . . . .
$$---------------[/go]


What other resources does White have?

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This post by ez4u was liked by 3 people: Marcus, topazg, unkx80
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