3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

daniel_the_smith · Post by **daniel_the_smith** » Thu May 06, 2010 9:01 am

Post by **Jordus** » Thu May 06, 2010 12:01 pm

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm65 Move 65 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

daniel_the_smith · Post by **daniel_the_smith** » Thu May 06, 2010 12:21 pm

topazg · Post by **topazg** » Thu May 06, 2010 12:24 pm

Wow, this could get devastating quickly:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm65 Continuation? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X 2 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X 3 . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . 9 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . 5 4 0 | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X 7 8 | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O 6 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm75 Continuation? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X 4 | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X X . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . 3 | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X 5 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . X 1 | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . X O O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X X O | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O O 2 | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O 8 7 X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X 6 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Dusk Eagle · Post by **Dusk Eagle** » Thu May 06, 2010 1:26 pm

For topazg:

topazg · Post by **topazg** » Thu May 06, 2010 1:34 pm

For Dusk Eagle:

Phelan · Post by **Phelan** » Thu May 06, 2010 5:09 pm

Move tomorrow, want to think about this with a clear head.

I'll probably cut here. I think Jordus is expecting the atari below :w66:

but that seems to allow black to still take sente, and seems not to leave any aji left for a corner invasion.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm65 Move 65 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O 2 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Phelan · Post by **Phelan** » Fri May 07, 2010 7:51 am

Oops, forgot about it. :oops:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm66 Move 66 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I see no other worthwile move here.

This is what I didn't like about the atari:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm66 Don't atari automatically. $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O 4 O 2 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . 5 X 1 3 | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

The descent still leaves some aji for black, but I prefer it this way:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm66 Followup to the descent? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O 5 O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . 3 X 2 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If black simply pulls up:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm66 Move 66 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . b a . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . c . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

a or b still seem possible places to invade.
Unrelatedly, I still want white to play around c first. :-?

daniel_the_smith · Post by **daniel_the_smith** » Fri May 07, 2010 8:32 am

I'm pretty sure Violence will play S13. I bet magicwand will then play r16 (it's a mean dan-player sort of move).

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm66 Move 66 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X 3 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X 2 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

...and then I don't see a good move for black

Maybe I'll ignore the corner and play Q13.

EDIT: after more reading, I don't think :w68:

above works, phew.

Violence · Post by **Violence** » Fri May 07, 2010 10:58 pm

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm67 Move 67 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . X 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Magicwand · Post by **Magicwand** » Sat May 08, 2010 3:52 am

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm68 Move 68 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . W X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Phelan · Post by **Phelan** » Sat May 08, 2010 5:07 am

Something I hadn't noticed before:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm69 Black group can now be attacked $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . a . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O 2 . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Black's Right side group now has some vulnerability, and can be pressed. Maybe this cut is not the best way, but there's some aji there.
I still want white to move first in the a area, I think whoever moves there first could decide the game.
This is because I think white is slightly ahead now that the group is alive. I'll make a post later with my estimate of the game. I'd appreciate it if some observers also do the same, so I have a basis for comparison when the game finishes.

daniel_the_smith · Post by **daniel_the_smith** » Sat May 08, 2010 7:46 pm

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm69 Move 69 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . 1 . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

It really feels like we have a lot of weaknesses. I don't really like our position. I almost played at a below because I wasn't sure we could live if the shown sequence occurred, but after some reading I'm 98% sure we can. I'd like to harass the white group some more but it would start to look like an attempt to kill and I think that would backfire as we have too many weaknesses. I was going to play at :b69:

below but I decided that the move I played helps with our weakness in the corner, takes some points on the top, prevents white from getting that point, and it keeps the possibility open of trying for a kill later.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bcm69 Move 69 Prisoners White 0 Black 1 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . X . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O . . O . O O a | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X X 2 | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O X X O O . O O X . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . X O X O X O X . 3 | $$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . X . . O X . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . X . O . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . 5 7 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . X 4 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O . . . O X O . O 6 . | $$ | . . . O . 1 . . . , X . X X O . . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I kinda think black must have made mistakes to get in this position. I wonder if they were mine...?

Magicwand · Post by **Magicwand** » Sat May 08, 2010 8:07 pm

daniel_the_smith · Post by **daniel_the_smith** » Sat May 08, 2010 8:26 pm

Life In 19x19

3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1

Re: 3v3 Malkovitch Rengo #1