127. ez4u vs topazg

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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Right, the game's about to get exciting. He can't easily ignore this, because the corner damage is great (although there are other huge points too, so he sort of can). He can't slide over the top, because I'll let him push me into his corner:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 5 . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . 4 2 O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Which means I think his only reasonable local response is to block and leave the aji for me to sweat over, and I'm gonna go take the big point. I'm pretty sure I'm unconditionally alive at the top now, and there are no great and crucifying points losses to take just to live in gote. So, why the bottom edge? Because I've been a bit foolish and made it huge:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . 4 . . 2 . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Just looking at those marked stones, how unpleasant does this feel? Pretty bad, I think. Bad enough, if I'm honest, that he may just play there now and ignore my last move - at least if he does do that I can poke around in the top left and be reasonably happy. However, I think my latest move is urgent, and if he does respond, I think the diagram below looks much better than the diagram above:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I have reasoning for my precise placement of 43. If you want to ask, please do. I'm also wanting the following, as it enables the :b45: -> :b49: push, but I think that just helps White a lot more than Black if I haven't already gotten a foothold on the bottom edge:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 3 . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . 9 . 5 O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 7 6 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . 8 , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Further thoughts:
Hmmm, I do have a good local response up there. I'm probably going to play at the bottom anyway, but I like this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . a . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . b O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . c . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
With miai of "a" and "b", it strikes me this is a good way of making profit. I may even play "c", as it makes "a" even easier to cash in on. This actually might be a really big move. Must do some more reading.
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Kirby
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by Kirby »

@topazg:
topazg wrote:...

I have reasoning for my precise placement of 43. If you want to ask, please do. ...
OK, I'll bite: What is the reasoning that you have for your precise placement of 43? :-)
be immersed
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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Kirby wrote:@topazg:
topazg wrote:...

I have reasoning for my precise placement of 43. If you want to ask, please do. ...
OK, I'll bite: What is the reasoning that you have for your precise placement of 43? :-)
Ok, with the caveat that my reasoning isn't necessarily good reasoning, it's as follows:

"High or Low"
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
White's marked stones make the bottom middle seem pretty big potentially, and I would rather attack the influence that they bring than with them than play for points and risk my whole right side framework being reduced too severely. On that note, the move I want to play next is my :b45: above, and I think the high move is better balanced with this position. In fact, :b45: feels so ideal, that I'm predicting the following :w44:, and hoping to use :b43: to be intimidating in the fight:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . c . . b . 8 . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 4 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . a . . . . 7 . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I have no idea what I'll want to do next, though "a" and "b" and "c" are some of my thoughts, but I think "a", :b43: , and :b47: make a good enough shape that it feels better than if :b43: was flat.

So, that's high and low, but why not K4 or M4?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . 3 . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . 4 . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
With M4, this feels far too ideal for White, and not only is Black's position smaller, but the further slide underneath is going to be really annoying to defend against. The flipside is K4, which feels dangerous:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . 3 . . 4 . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Ok, that's just throwing stones around, but it feels like I'm too far away from my stones to be happy in this position. He may even pincer my choice of :b43:, but at least if he does, I can do the following:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . 4 . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . a . O . 7 . . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Now not only am I partially settled, but I can also aim at the aji around "a" later.

Likewise, he can't make a two space extension with my move, as this seems terrible for White:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . 1 . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . . O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 8 7 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . 6 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . a 4 5 . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
And, the one point jump (at "a") feels too small and overconcentrated to be of enough value just yet.

Hope that explains my thoughts some :)

PS The marked stones are the ones that I think dictate why this area is so big and urgent to get a stone into asap.
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User avatar
ez4u
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by ez4u »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . 2 O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I am not particularly happy with the result in the upper right. My upper left ended up looking awfully thin. We will see if the exchange of :b41: for :w42: hurts of helps me. It does not seem to me that Black needed to play :b41:. Even though Black can dent White's corner playing from this direction, if it helps be get a reasonable result in the center, I will be satisfied I think. On the other hand, maybe I just do not understand the balance of the game correctly. :scratch:
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Just off to bed, but I want to think about this one :)
Contemplating one of the following:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . b . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . a X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . 2 O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , c . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Into the valley of the shadow of death and all that, I'm gonna go tenuki here. Why?

Well, the point of :b41: was to give enough security and stability to just live with my top group, and ideally prevent him from getting a number of sente moves against that group if I tenuki. I think I've achieved that, as that single stone is expendable and I'm not convinced he can reduce me to one eye with any moves locally there, even with a followup (unless the original move was an overstretch, in which I would probably choose to respond to it for the sake of profit).

Also, my followups are aji-keshi locally, so I'm going to treat :b41: as kikashi. My ideas:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 3 7 5 . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . 8 6 X 4 . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . 2 O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 9 . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Here, I settle, but the thickness he builds after :w48: mean that :b49: is kind of required or he pushes through my stone and creates some real territory up there. As as result, he secures his top left corner, I get an extra 4 or 5 points for my (hopefully!) already alive group, and he gets sente. This is unacceptable.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . a . . 3 X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . 4 2 O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 5 . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X b X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . c O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Here, the same situation applies, except my shape is considerably worse at the top with an extra stone, and I've made them semi-heavy, I'm probably going to want to respond to :w44: or why play :b43:, and it doesn't let me jump in at "a" without sacrificing the two stones. Besides which, I think he may even be able to tenuki :b43: , although it's better than the kosumi I think.

I'd rather leave :b45: and :b43: and "a" all as positions which I can use and abuse when he shows his cards in the area. As long as I'm alive with the big group, which move I want to play is dependent on what bit he decides is important. My underlying feeling is that if he protects the corner, I should play :b45: , and if he pushes to cut, I should invade the top left. I'm also glad I haven't forced him to capture that stone now at N14, because if I do get :b45: in the last diagram, I may be able to seriously harrass that group after playing "c" myself, particularly now I've got a foothold on the bottom edge of the board.

Let's hope I'm not wrong up there!
Addendum:
I think I was wrong with regards to being able to get J3. I predict this if he pincers:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . X . . |
$$ | . . . c . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . 4 . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . 6 . a . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I have a plan for this anyway, but :w46: threatens "a", so :b47: is a standard splitting response and, I think, kind of forced, which means he gets :w46: and :w48:. Annoying, but where're his points? I just need to make sure he doesn't start killing things. "b" then becomes big, and "c" has already started to become urgent I think.
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by Psychee »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . . |
$$ | . . a O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I feel a is very big, but maybe not urgent; maybe b is urgent now?
求而不得
舍而不能

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Magicwand
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by Magicwand »

it is not much but...does that exchange help black?
in my opinion it destroy aji of jumping in at marked point..so it is aji-keshi.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . B . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . C W O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 3 . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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ez4u
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by ez4u »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . 4 . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The left will have to wait for now. I think I can not let topazg expand uncontested here. So is his stone sandwiched between mine or is mine sandwiched between his? Let's find out!
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Let the party begin.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm45 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . a . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X W X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X W . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . W W W . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , X . O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . 2 . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
:b49: overplay? Time to read, I don't want to compromise my right side or die in the lower middle, so this need handling with extreme care. Either way, I expect to sacrifice :b49: just as I did with N14, but I must keep White separated, must keep my points on the right, and must live with :b43: and :b47:. We may have some fireworks on the way, but hopefully that'll keep things entertaining for everyone :)

I hope I have time to play "a" as a threat against the marked group so that I can use :b49: as a splitting attack, but I may not get to do this. This game is fun !

I'm happy with the game so far, it feels pretty fundamentally even still, but I'm painfully aware that Dave most likely has superior reading to me, so I can't afford to blindly play semi-intuitive moves.
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by ez4u »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . 6 , X . O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Squeeze this stone toward the top and see what comes of it. As things develop we will see who turns first to the left. I am also eying Q10 because the Black stones in the upper right do not have so much eye shape yet.
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoners: :b100: :w100:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O , X . O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Hmmm, cute, and clever, I hadn't even read that, as normally an "already pincered" three point jump on the fourth line leads to problems, even with it being White's move. However, simply running out doesn't give me eyes, and threatens to ruin my right hand side. It's not like I can build thickness to attack things, and he's clearly locally stronger than me in this area. This could be a complicated fight, but I think I'm the weaker here, so contacting to settle makes sense to me.

My reading is basically as follows:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Ladder doesn't work, but so what
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O , X 9 O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm41 Not sure which I want yet
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 9 7 8 . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O , X . O 9 . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm43 Prisoners:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . X O O . O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . X . . . . . X O . X O X . |
$$ | . . . O . . O O . , X . X O . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . X O . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 7 5 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . O , X 6 O . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . O . . 9 8 . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Well, this may be short, but the ride'll be worth the admission fee :D
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ez4u
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by ez4u »

I believe I should think about this situation. As I am off to my usual Saturday schedule = Go followed by drinking, I probably will not post the next play until tomorrow about this time. Appologies! :bow:
Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21
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topazg
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by topazg »

ez4u wrote:I believe I should think about this situation. As I am off to my usual Saturday schedule = Go followed by drinking, I probably will not post the next play until tomorrow about this time. Appologies! :bow:
Don't apologise, have a wonderful day, and come back inspired :)

We have an audience to entertain ;)
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SpongeBob
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Re: 127. ez4u vs topazg

Post by SpongeBob »

Yeah, audience is watching you ...
Great game, excellent comments! Thanks for playing guys.
Stay out of my territory! (W. White, aka Heisenberg)
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