The Sourdough Bread-Baking Thread

[usagi]

Mmm something's baking in the oven? What is it? Delicious, wholesome bread!

But it isn't just any bread. You can't buy this bread in stores. Well you can, but it's hard to find. And usually a little expensive. Unless you know a guy. Or maybe if you live near San Fransisco. The taste is to die for, it's special, once you try this bread they say you can't go back to store-bought loaves. Some say the dough used to bake these special loaves is hundreds of years old -- dough passed down from generation to generation. It even has legendary life-giving, health-restoring properties, containing special enzymes which the body needs to help it break down food but which are otherwise quite rare. In fact it is said that it helps with diabetes and even people who can't eat wheat gluten can easily digest this type of bread.

So I decided to start my own tradition. I put in a cup of flour and a cup of water and I mixed it all up. I put it in a glass bowl and put a damp drying towel over it like I saw my mommy doing a long time ago. The next day I poured half into a new bowl and added a half cup of water and a half cup of flour to both bowls. To one of the bowls I added a tablespoon of liquid fructose and an ounce of lemon juice. I mixed both bowls and set them again using slightly wet dry-cloths.

And.. tomorrow is another day..

[tj86430]

You can't buy this bread in stores. Well you can, but it's hard to find. And usually a little expensive. Unless you know a guy. Or maybe if you live near San Fransisco.

Or you live in Finland (or possibly other Nordic countries, swedes at least have it, I'm not sure about others).

[gowan]

Mmm something's baking in the oven? What is it? Delicious, wholesome bread!

But it isn't just any bread. You can't buy this bread in stores. Well you can, but it's hard to find. And usually a little expensive. Unless you know a guy. Or maybe if you live near San Fransisco. The taste is to die for, it's special, once you try this bread they say you can't go back to store-bought loaves. Some say the dough used to bake these special loaves is hundreds of years old -- dough passed down from generation to generation. It even has legendary life-giving, health-restoring properties, containing special enzymes which the body needs to help it break down food but which are otherwise quite rare. In fact it is said that it helps with diabetes and even people who can't eat wheat gluten can easily digest this type of bread.

So I decided to start my own tradition. I put in a cup of flour and a cup of water and I mixed it all up. I put it in a glass bowl and put a damp drying towel over it like I saw my mommy doing a long time ago. The next day I poured half into a new bowl and added a half cup of water and a half cup of flour to both bowls. To one of the bowls I added a tablespoon of liquid fructose and an ounce of lemon juice. I mixed both bowls and set them again using slightly wet dry-cloths.

And.. tomorrow is another day..

Do you add yeast at any point or does it get it from the enviornment?

[GoCat]

Love sourdough... used to make it regularly at home. There are starters to be had at grocery stores or online, or (as usagi is doing) yeasts can be collected from the environment. Your flavors may vary. (usagi: you might consider setting your bowl outdoors.) If done well, no additional baking yeast is added, but rise times will be longer.

There are challenges to a good sourdough loaf. How much to knead; how long to rise; oven environment. My failing was that I was never able to get that thick, hard crust of a good Bay Area baguette.

Oh, and don't forget to try some of your starter in sourdough pancakes (or waffles).

Love sourdough!

(Someone once accused us my household of being too yeasty -- we were making our own breads and brewing our own beer at the time.0

[gowan]

Love sourdough... used to make it regularly at home. There are starters to be had at grocery stores or online, or (as usagi is doing) yeasts can be collected from the environment. Your flavors may vary. (usagi: you might consider setting your bowl outdoors.) If done well, no additional baking yeast is added, but rise times will be longer.

There are challenges to a good sourdough loaf. How much to knead; how long to rise; oven environment. My failing was that I was never able to get that thick, hard crust of a good Bay Area baguette.

Oh, and don't forget to try some of your starter in sourdough pancakes (or waffles).

Love sourdough!

(Someone once accused us my household of being too yeasty -- we were making our own breads and brewing our own beer at the time.0

I've heard that some of the special quality of San Francisco sourdough is due to the local environment: sea air, fog, mild temperatures, etc. It's like the terroir of wines, something you can't exactly duplicate somewhere else. I love SF sourdough but I'm happy to experience the "terroir" of other locales.

[DrStraw]

I've heard that some of the special quality of San Francisco sourdough is due to the local environment: sea air, fog, mild temperatures, etc. It's like the terroir of wines, something you can't exactly duplicate somewhere else. I love SF sourdough but I'm happy to experience the "terroir" of other locales.

I don't know much about it myself but my wife says this is the case. We have not bought store bread in years. All that we eat is made at home from grains which are ground fresh just before the bread is made. I am not talking about a bread machine - each loaf is individual and different. She has tried to make sourdough but with limited success. It tastes sour but not like San Francisco sour. She is convinced that it is all a matter of the yeast you have in the local environment. Still the bread we eat is infinitely better than anything you can find in a store.

[kokomi]

It would be better to have pictures as well...

[usagi]

I've heard that some of the special quality of San Francisco sourdough is due to the local environment: sea air, fog, mild temperatures, etc. It's like the terroir of wines, something you can't exactly duplicate somewhere else. I love SF sourdough but I'm happy to experience the "terroir" of other locales.

I don't know much about it myself but my wife says this is the case. We have not bought store bread in years. All that we eat is made at home from grains which are ground fresh just before the bread is made. I am not talking about a bread machine - each loaf is individual and different. She has tried to make sourdough but with limited success. It tastes sour but not like San Francisco sour. She is convinced that it is all a matter of the yeast you have in the local environment. Still the bread we eat is infinitely better than anything you can find in a store.

It may help to understand something of the chemistry of yeast and how the starter is made. Actually you've probably heard all this before, so please excuse the run-down. First, what gives sourdough bread it's sour is some sort of bacteria called lactobactillus sanfransiscoum (please forgive me for not spelling that properly). Anyways there are apparently 125 species of yeast as well, any one or ones which will eventually begin to live in your starter.

How the starter is made; from what I've heard, the yeast does not actually activate in your starter until many days after you have begun feeding it. What happens first is bacteria come in and start growing, which lowers the PH to between 4 and 6, which then kills them all off (or they just stop growing) which then provides the fertile ground for the yeast to activate. The bacteria you want (and any other bacteria) actually compete with the yeasts on some level, so this is why adding vinegar or sugar or things like that, while they may result in a quicker starter, end up spoiling the taste -- you need to wait for the bacteria to run their course and then the yeast can activate in a sort of symbiotic balance.

That's also why each starter is different. The balance is different.

Anyways some tricks I heard to make the dough more "sour" -- stop me if you've heard this before --

1. From the starter you make sponge. Thats when you take a cup of starter and put it in a bowl with a cup of flour and cup of water. Leave that overnight or for 24 hours. Then make your bread using the sponge (add another cup or two of flour). Of course, modify the amounts depending on how many loaves you make at a time.

2. Don't ferment your starter or sponge with salt in it. Add the salt when you add the flour to make dough.

3. Use less starter/sponge than normal. I've heard reports of good results with as little as two tablespoons of starter in the sponge versus a cup (again depending on how much you're making).

4. The beat down; don't forget to beat down your dough after it's risen the first time, then roll it back up into a loaf (seam side down!) -- apparently this beat-down and re-rise period helps more of the lactobacterius sanfransiscoum (sorry for the spelling) spread throughout the loaf.

Now, I am a complete amateur, but you're not going to believe this, everyone who has tried my sourdough bread so far has suggested I sell it or offered to buy loaves from me. I've already got a few sales to friends and family (hey, they offered!)

Not that I am trying to open a bakery or anything but that's really interesting to me. maybe I got lucky with my starter. What I did was make the sponge using 50% starter A and 50% starter B. Oh, and I also dabbled with starter B during the feeding stage; I added some sweet potato flour and tapioca flour to it. it smells really good, much better than starter A. I'm still experimenting.

I think I will like this hobby a lot though.

[daniel_the_smith]

I made some really good bread this way before I quit eating wheat.

[hyperpape]

http://www.marginalrevolution.com/margi ... /ahem.html

dts: I actually thought of you when this appeared in my RSS reader

[Redbeard]

Not specifically about sourdough but posted today on http://www.SeattleGoCenter.org:

Bake Bread Play Go
Our talented breadmaker, Chris K., will be giving a lesson on breadmaking at the Go Center this Saturday from 1:30 to 5:00 p.m., October 30. There will be time to play Go as well.

[usagi]

I've been ruminating recently over baking bread, and it suddenly struck me how baking sourdough bread is just like playing a game of go.

In go, you have to build a base before attacking; you have to make yourself strong before attacking your opponent (i.e. mind your own stones). And, when you bake sourdough bread, you have to feed your starter before you can proof your sponge.

It's amazing the little ways in which everything in life is connected as one.