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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #21 Posted: Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:55 am 
Gosei

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Was liked: 129
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . B X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Unhidden:
I didn't really expect this, but blocking from this side seems to work better with my stones on the lower side. Other moves I considered were Q11 and R12, but I think Q11 is a bit too territory-oriented, and I hope I can slide to R12 later if necessary.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Thu Jul 15, 2010 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #22 Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:07 am 
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OGS: emeraldemon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Not really happy with my position right now, but we'll just have to play it out.
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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #23 Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:17 am 
Gosei

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Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Unhidden: For once my opponent did exactly what I expected :lol:. I want to keep his group under attack, but I'm pushing from behind so I need to jump, yet N10 would create a lot of cutting points if he pushes through the gap. This seems a very natural choice.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Thu Jul 15, 2010 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #24 Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:40 am 
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OGS: emeraldemon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . W X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X 2 X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 3 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If B plays this way I can hope to gain a little by pressuring the cut stones.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O 1 . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

This way I settle easily and can finally turn to other parts of the board.
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Offline daniel_the_smith
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #25 Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:48 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . 5 O 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X 2 X 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X 4 O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think black would actually play this way.

Over all, I greatly prefer black's board position at the moment.

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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #26 Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:40 am 
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Sorry about the delay, but I won't be able to make my next move until tomorrow.

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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #27 Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:26 pm 
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Take your time. I'm in no hurry :)
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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #28 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 1:10 am 
Gosei

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O B . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Unhidden:
My main problem was whether I should stress the safety of my own stones as I believe I'm doing with this move, or keep more pressure on his weak group. Now he can capture R15 if he wants to and his group will probably have easier life, but I will get the corner and have possibilities to expanding it to the left. He will probably come up with a move I haven't anticipated, though :D

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Last edited by tj86430 on Thu Jul 15, 2010 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #29 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:53 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X W . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


It's really tempting to read the hide tags! Well, I'm not happy with my position so far, but after this my group is settled and has a chunk of the corner. The next important areas are the bottom right (maybe 3-3 invasion?) and the top, both my 3-4 and the two stones currently being pressured.
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Offline daniel_the_smith
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #30 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:03 am 
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Wow, black made a big mistake, he should have protected that cut somehow. Letting white have easy life for his weak group is very, very good for white. Now I think the position is roughly equal again; black was way ahead before this exchange.

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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #31 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:31 am 
Gosei

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . B . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Unhidden:
According to the plan. I will secure the corner and threaten to expand it to the left. His weak group is better of, but perhaps not entirely safe yet.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Harleqin
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #32 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:36 am 
Lives in sente
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tj86430 wrote:
His weak group is better of, but perhaps not entirely safe yet.

This is a little heuristic: if you give an enemy group a ponnuki, it is basically alive. Exceptions may occur if the group is tightly enclosed.

In this case, the white group can now be regarded as completely alive and strong.

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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #33 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:52 am 
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It's exciting that we're starting to get some comments, I can't wait to read them!

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . B 2 . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O 1 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If you agree.

So which is better: extend?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . B 2 . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O 1 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |[/go]



Or capture directly?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=0, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . B . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O X 1 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |[/go]


Extending makes a guaranteed eye, but also lets black secure the corner in sente. Capturing threatens means if black plays 2 above, I can tennuki, if I'm willing to accept less eyespace. The main thing is that I don't want black to be able to chase me around the board for more thickness, so I'm taking the eye. I'd rather be solid now so I can fight later.
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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #34 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 11:49 am 
Gosei

Posts: 1348
Location: Finland
Liked others: 49
Was liked: 129
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
I agree. I'm also very keen to read the comments afterwards.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . B . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Unhidden:
I think it's about time to do something to the left side. I could approach his stone in the upper left, but I'm afraid he will pincer and I will end up with a weak group while he solidifies his lower left. Therefore I play in the middle, where I can extend to either upwards or downwards and have a secure base.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #35 Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 3:03 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1744
Liked others: 704
Was liked: 288
KGS: greendemon
Tygem: greendemon
DGS: smaragdaemon
OGS: emeraldemon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . . W . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm pretty sure I can take this in sente and come back to the shimari.
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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #36 Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:38 am 
Gosei

Posts: 1348
Location: Finland
Liked others: 49
Was liked: 129
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X B 7 . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . 6 4 2 1 O 9 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Agree?

Unhidden:
I must say that his invasion doesn't surprise me. I just had a hard time deciding which side to block, and I eventually decided this side is slightly better. I expect him to play the standard joseki. The only problem is that it will be gote for me. I could play the double hane variation (4 at 5), but there white can complicate things, so I think I will stick to the conventional one.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #37 Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:46 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1744
Liked others: 704
Was liked: 288
KGS: greendemon
Tygem: greendemon
DGS: smaragdaemon
OGS: emeraldemon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Ok, the moyo on the right is worth about 35 points of solid territory, which is a lot. But I'm not about to give up this game yet. I have some control of 3 of the corners, which is over 30 points if I can keep them. I still have to do something about the top and the left, but I think I can figure out something.

As for my last move, I think it's the biggest point, and black should have played there instead of the middle left. I can still make some good use out of the top stone I played before:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . 2 . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm not saying this is the best way to play on top, I'll have to think about it some more, but there's potential. As for the lower left shimari, it has a lot less potential for growth, but I can ignore black 1 above and still fell like the group is solid. If he probes in side, I'll try to use the thickness I gain to attack his left group and reduce the right potential.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #38 Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:52 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1744
Liked others: 704
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KGS: greendemon
Tygem: greendemon
DGS: smaragdaemon
OGS: emeraldemon
As a side note, I think tj (?) made a mistake in playing this joseki to completion: with so much outside thickness, black can probably play a stronger attack, or at least leave of the final protection for now.
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Offline tj86430
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #39 Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:03 am 
Gosei

Posts: 1348
Location: Finland
Liked others: 49
Was liked: 129
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . B . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Unhidden:
There are a couple of large points left in this opening. First I felt I must make my lone stone on the left more secure, otherwise he will play around C9 and I don't have enough room to make a decent base. I decided to play this first, since this looks so big to me and I think this is sente, so I get to play C8 later. If he doesn't respond to this, I will have a very powerful attack on his two weak stones at the top. Other big points are around G3, R12 and N17.

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Last edited by tj86430 on Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline emeraldemon
 Post subject: Re: 45. emeraldemon (3k) vs. tj86430 (7k)
Post #40 Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 11:14 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1744
Liked others: 704
Was liked: 288
KGS: greendemon
Tygem: greendemon
DGS: smaragdaemon
OGS: emeraldemon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O X . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , O . . X . X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . X . . . . X . O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . X X X O O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


The top is very big, of course, but I'm going to offer a trade for the left. If he accepts and plays a move on top, I'll try to bring a strong attack against his left stone for profit. It's hard to say if I can succeed, but I can't stand the idea of passively defending when I'm already behind. I may regret not blocking, but I feel like there's still some aji in this position even if black gets the next move. If he jumps out with the stone on the left, I can come back to defend, happy with my sente extension.
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Board index » L19²GO (Malkovich) » 1-on-1 Malkovich games

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