49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

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Magicwand
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
intresting... i didnt exptect that..
i will still go with my original plan + little change.
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X B X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Reduce aji as much as possible, then turn to attack.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X B X O O . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
wow..did he just gave me sente? the game is over...
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Violence »

Did... he just... take gote?

Man... I feel like I've already won.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X X X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . B . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
tj86430
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by tj86430 »

Can someone explain to me why this wouldn't have been fairly good for Magicwand:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X 2 O X 1 . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


To me it seems to keep black separated and at least somewhat wulnerable
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Chew Terr »

"wow..did he just gave me sente? the game is over..."
"Did... he just... take gote?Man... I feel like I've already won."

One of the most confusing things about listening to stronger players talk is how confident they are when they disagree with each other.


Oh, and TJ, the best I can think of is it might force black to capture R12, giving strength on the outside and sealing white's corner more soundly? But that's just supposition. You could probably ask MW now, as the option's no longer there.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by daniel_the_smith »

The comments in this game are hilarious.

@tj
I think black takes r13 in a ladder and white's group becomes quite weak, but I'm not 100% sure.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by shapenaji »

tj86430 wrote:
Can someone explain to me why this wouldn't have been fairly good for Magicwand:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X 2 O X 1 . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


To me it seems to keep black separated and at least somewhat wulnerable


Well, there's this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X X O X O 2 O 1 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X . X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X . X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Tactics yes, Tact no...
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by phrax »

I have a positional question about this move. Killing white's group is big, but the side feels bigger to me. I'd think white playing around 'a' would be a bigger pain than the center group living. Am I just way off base on this?


Violence wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X X X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . B . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . a . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by shapenaji »

phrax wrote:
I have a positional question about this move. Killing white's group is big, but the side feels bigger to me. I'd think white playing around 'a' would be a bigger pain than the center group living. Am I just way off base on this?


Violence wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X X X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . B . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . a . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


It *might* be bigger if white actually could keep that side, but that's really unlikely, white would likely need another 2 more moves
Tactics yes, Tact no...
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by dfan »

Chew Terr wrote:"wow..did he just gave me sente? the game is over..."
"Did... he just... take gote? Man... I feel like I've already won."

This game is hilarious.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by phrax »

@shapenaji
Thanks. I figured they understood the position better than me, although I didn't completely rule out bloodlust-blinders. :)
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Violence »

Gotta do some work again. I'll move tomorrow.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Dusk Eagle »

phrax:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X X X O O . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

As an addition to what shapenaji said, the low white stones on both sides make the side a lot smaller for white than if one of the stones was on the fourth line. Fourth line is for growing and engulfing more, whereas third line is better for settling, but it doesn't expand as well.
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Re: 49. Magicwand(3d) vs Violence(?d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=1, B=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X X . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O X O X X O . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X X O X X O X X X O O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . O O O O . . X O . O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . X , . . . X . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
if you dont attack your opponent right way you will lose points.
that is exactly what is happening.. bad attack leaves aji so he doesnt even get influence out of that attack.
i can feel that he is desperate. i think he will resign soon.
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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