#226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

Sorry for not playing a move. I'll be returning to Go in July, so I plan on resuming this game within the next several weeks.
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

Hey, TIM82! If you still wish to continue this game, I'm all for it. :)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Trigger accepted.
I haven't looked at this position for awhile, but it looks very interesting! :) My original intention was to play a moyo game. A moyo is more difficult to achieve with white (that is, without giving up the advantage to the other player), so the moyo has to appear "naturally." This can take several forms. For instance, I can keep offering exchanges (in particular, corner or side josekis) where I always seek to take the outside. The other player may wish to resist this by insisting on taking the outside himself, but the idea is that this would be an unfavorable exchange for him. In other words, if he were to try taking the outside, he would put me in the lead, even though I wouldn't be able to get a moyo.

Another way to get a moyo "naturally" is by attacking (and, hopefully, chasing) a weak group. This is the approach I hope to utilize in the present game position. I will attack the group on the left and also, hopefully, the cutting stone :b27:. A great outcome for me would be if I could force black to live small on the left side or to force black to run with that group into the center while I build influence around it on both sides.

For my :w28: move, I also had the choice to play the following.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O 1 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I rejected this choice because, although I could attack Black on the left side more severely, the cutting group :b27: would become significantly stronger than at present (which would also significantly reduce the aji from my two stones at the top) and so would make the cutting group almost impervious to attack.

Given that I did not play at G13, Black needs to decide if he can afford to play there himself or if he has to defend on the left side, first. Stated differently, if Black plays G13 next, will I be forced to connect at F13 or will I be able to hane at E11 with profit?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . a 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
TIM82
Lives with ko
Posts: 241
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:24 pm
Rank: EGF 1 dan
GD Posts: 0
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by TIM82 »

I had forgotten this altogether in meantime. Good that the forum send a notification of your message. :-) I'll try to get back to this, need to collect my thoughts first though.
TIM82
Lives with ko
Posts: 241
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:24 pm
Rank: EGF 1 dan
GD Posts: 0
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by TIM82 »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm23
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . 3 2 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I have to admit I have no idea what Plans I may have had. Really dont want to give the point a took with :b29: to white though, and I think it should be possible to handle the left side after following expected exchange, although it does not look pretty
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm23
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . 3 2 9 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 8 7 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , a . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

I'll need to think here some more. By the way, feel free to view follow my other "Takemiya" game at will. :)
I probably have to connect. The hane, although very complicated, probably doesn't quite work, but I'll double-check.

On an unrelated issue, I briefly looked through the earlier moves in the game, and I don't agree with my 18 move anymore. I should have pincerred then, gotten a stable group, and sought to enlarge the moyo on the left/bottom from there. Oh well, past is the past.
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

Maybe I can hane at E11 after all. :study: :study: :study:
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 2 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
If I haned, I could not see how to keep my position together after the following sequence, and so the move in the game was forced.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X 5 4 2 X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . 3 X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . 6 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
TIM82
Lives with ko
Posts: 241
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:24 pm
Rank: EGF 1 dan
GD Posts: 0
Universal go server handle: TIM82
Online playing schedule: sometimes KGS
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by TIM82 »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm29
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . , . X . . . , . . . . . , X . .|
$$ |. O . O . X O 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . 2 1 . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. X O O . O . . . , . . . . . O . . .|
$$ |. X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The Intrepid
Lives in gote
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:08 pm
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: #226: TIM82 vs. The Intrepid: Takemiya Style 2

Post by The Intrepid »

Given Black's move, the question becomes: how severely can I attack the Black group on the left? I definitely shouldn't be able to kill it. Instead, my goal will be to force it to either run into the center or seek small confined life on the left edge. Ideally, I'll be able to do this in sente, such that I get the chance to play first in the top right corner.
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
Post Reply